| Posted: Thu May 17th, 2007 02:45 AM |
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kempin
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Hey guys,
I'm new to bullet casting--in fact, I haven't even tried it yet; I am just looking for the right excuse--but I have a question.
My brother gave me a .50 caliber muzzle loader. I am also new to muzzle loading, and was unpleasantly surprised at the cost of bullets.
Here's the question: Can you cast for a muzzle loader using wheel weights, or does it need to be pure (soft) lead?
Appreciate your feedback,
-Kempin
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| Posted: Thu May 17th, 2007 05:10 AM |
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Ranch 13
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Purelead is preferred , but wheelweights will do. You do need to be watchful tho as the wheelweights as of late seem to have a bit more antimony and seem to be a lot harder than in yesteryear. If they get to hard the patch won't grip well on the roundballs.
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| Posted: Thu May 17th, 2007 01:06 PM |
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Charley
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What type of mold is it? Conical or ball? Generally speaking, softer is better when it comes to muzzleloaders. If it is a Lee REAL conical, you probably won't be able to load anything harder than lead, If it is an undersized conical that obturates up, or a round ball, you can get away with using a harder alloy like wheel weights. BTW, if casting with pure lead, I find I get the best results running the pot pretty hot.
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| Posted: Tue May 22nd, 2007 08:20 PM |
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kempin
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Thanks for the feedback guys. I've got wheel weights. Any suggestions on where I might get pure lead for a muzzle loader?
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| Posted: Tue May 22nd, 2007 09:56 PM |
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ghrit
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kempin wrote: Thanks for the feedback guys. I've got wheel weights. Any suggestions on where I might get pure lead for a muzzle loader? Try a plumbing supply house, they might have some for repairs to old caulked hub and spigot cast iron sanitary drain pipe
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| Posted: Tue May 22nd, 2007 11:31 PM |
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Charley
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Try to find a caster who loads for cartridge guns, and see if you can do a swap. I hate to buy lead!
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| Posted: Wed May 23rd, 2007 01:07 AM |
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wolfkill
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http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=174735
I actually got 50 pounds one time I won at a black powder shoot. I'm afraid to say I poured alot of it into big fishing sinkers and weights for goose decoys. I've kept the sinkers in sealed ammo containers and it's as bright as the day I poured it.
Whats the story on battery lead again...other than it's no good 
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| Posted: Wed May 23rd, 2007 03:23 AM |
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Charley
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Whats the story on battery lead again...other than it's no good
Cadmium and other nasty metals. Very bad juju.
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| Posted: Wed May 23rd, 2007 05:45 PM |
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kempin
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If I do have to resort to buying lead, what about lead shot? Is that pure lead, or at least suitable for muzzle loading?
-Kempin
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| Posted: Wed May 23rd, 2007 06:27 PM |
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steve a
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kempin wrote: If I do have to resort to buying lead, what about lead shot? Is that pure lead, or at least suitable for muzzle loading?
-Kempin
It would be cheaper to buy lead from a plumbing supply. Also, lead shot is hardend. I think it has antimony in it.
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| Posted: Thu May 24th, 2007 04:41 AM |
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Ranch 13
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Check with the local dentist and xray techs. There's all sorts pure of lead used in association with xrays and they are usually glad to find some fool to take it off their hands.
Failing that check with http://www.buffaloarms.com for the usually best prices on lead in ingots.
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| Posted: Sat Jun 23rd, 2007 12:13 AM |
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ohiococonut
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Many years ago I did use wheel weights to cast maxi balls for my .50cal TC Hawkin Cougar but it was a pita to prep the metal. The wheel weights may work if you run the temp high and constantly skim off all of the dross. And don't add any flux or beewax, you'll only help it remix and keep the components in suspension. What you're trying to do is seperate the tin and antimony by bringing it to the top. You normally won't do this for hard cast slugs but this will help make the metal softer. Once you think you've scraped off all you can you'll need to drop the temp back down a little to avoid frosty slugs. Drop the slugs on an old towel and let them air cool slowly. You really won't know until you cast a couple and give it the old thumb nail test. I melted all of mine in a big cast iron pot first and made ingots to use in my smaller casting pot where I constantly skimmed too. Unless you plan on melting a few hundred pounds you might be better off just finding pure lead.
Stay away from lead shot, it's generally marked chilled or hard and it's too expensive to be remelting. The bags of harder shot usually list the antimony content on the bag. Battery lead IS bad juju, don't do it or you'll be breathing a lot of nasty carcinogens. And stay away from the taped on wheel weights. Some manufacturers have gone to zinc and it melts at only 200degrees more so a hot pot won't let them float, which is a dead giveaway.
I have a ton of wheelweights I got for free from a local tire shop and about 300lbs of pure lead I got REALLY cheap but it's also getting harder to find and shipping weight can be a killer. Come to think of it I've also got about 250lbs of lead shot in various sizes and 20lbs of pure tin. I'm sure glad I was/am a pack rat!  The cost of metals has gone sky high.
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| Posted: Wed Nov 14th, 2007 01:27 AM |
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Ohio Rusty
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Getting in a little late on this thread, but I thought I'd chime in, for prosperity sake anyway. 50 years from now someone may need this advice. For the traditional muzzleloader with the non-removeable breech plug, pure lead is really your best option if you are shooting a conical bullet. Being you have to stuff the bullet down the bore, and the rifling has to squeeze itself into the bullet. It's best to have a soft, pure lead so the rifling can easily squeeze or bite into the bullet. If you are using a cloth patch or a plastic sabot around a bullet, you can use wheel weight lead. Lots of smoothbore shooters I know shoot wheel weight lead. There are 2 disadvantages to using wheel weight lead in a traditional muzzleloader when hunting (non-removable breeech plug).
BP guns don't shoot nearly as fast as modern smokeless guns do. High velocity is what make lead smush and expand upon impact. Hard lead bullets moving at slow velocities out of BP guns expand poorly on game animals. Sometimes, not at all. As the soft, pure lead bullet expands, the wound channel gets bigger letting out more blood, imparting more trauma, dispatching your game animal quicker. You lose these advantages with hard lead bullets like made from wheelweights.
The other issue is getting the bullet out. With a modern inline, this isn't an issue as if you need to remove the bullet because it won't fire (oil or water in the powder, bad primers won't go off, etc), all you do is remove the breechplug and pound the bullet and sabot out the other end. With the traditional muzzleloader, you are going to need a screw-type bullet puller on the end of your ramrod. The screw won't penetrate the hard lead bullet, so consequently you can't get the bullet out unless you go and buy one of the CO2 type bullet removers. If you are on a hunting trip, or out in the woods, this is not an option. Now you have a gun that won't fire, and you can't get the extra hard bullet out made from wheel weights. End of Hunt, ruined day, etc.
So .... to avoid the above problems, use pure lead bullets when hunting. Punching paper ot target shooting you can shoot what ever lead you like, no harm done. When you can get extra soft lead for BP bullets, squirrel it away as that is truly the best stuff to use for BP hunting guns. I'm no expert, but pure lead has worked for my muzzleloaders since 1971 ....... Just passing oin what I've learned.
Ohio Rusty
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| Posted: Thu Nov 15th, 2007 06:29 AM |
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pegleg4570
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Muzzle Loaders, and Most BPCR's have Deep Grooves & Slow Twist.
If a Bullet does not come out the end you need to Pull It with a Screw Type Puller.
I also carry a Ball Discharger....A CO2 adapter to fit over the Nipple, and /or Flash Hole....I have Percussion, and Flinch Locks.
As I have stated before I shoot Pure lead in My Muzzle Loaders, and BPCR's.
Good Going Rusty...
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| Posted: Fri Nov 16th, 2007 04:25 AM |
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drinks
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I shoot patched balls and Lee REALs in .45 and .50, I use wws and a short starter and have no major problems using wws.
I use 777 and a 50-50 peanut oil/ bees wax lube.
Only problem with the lube is that the mice keep eating the lube!
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| Posted: Fri Nov 16th, 2007 04:43 AM |
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Ranch 13
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Drinks does that lube stay soft for long or does it get hard if left out ? How much residue does that peanut oil leave behind? Will the stuff work for smokeless loads?
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| Posted: Fri Nov 16th, 2007 04:18 PM |
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drinks
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Ranch, I got the recipe from a person in Montana who has used it for a number of years in ML and BPCR, he has no hard fouling cake buildup with real BP and leading is not a problem.
Easy made, just get equal volumes of Beeswax and peanut oil, warm up gadually and stir until well mixed, then add a few shavings of a real soap, Ivory, P&G, Fels and stir it in. The stearic acid helps keep it stable when it gets hot.
I have found it stays pretty much the same stiffness all year, but my temperature extreams are from 20+ to 100+.
Peanut oil has about the highest flash point of the cooking oils and has low carbon residue, both good things in lubes.
Being non petroleum, it does not make a mess with real BP.
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| Posted: Fri Nov 16th, 2007 06:24 PM |
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Ranch 13
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Thanks drinks.
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