| Posted: Wed Apr 22nd, 2009 01:07 PM |
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Slingshot
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Hello all,
I am about to venture into some unknown territory. I have limited experience with BP, mostly with muzzleloaders. I wish to reload 45/70 goverment for my Sharps Replica rifle 32" barrel. I am not really impressed by the BP substitues so I plan on using the real deal.
Any storage suggestions? I do not plan on storing my BP in my smokeless powder cabinet and plan on only having a pound or 2 at one time.
What kind of BP 2F, 3F?
I have read a few books and still have some questions. Most say to let the powder flow down a tube approx. 24 - 32" into the case, why? what advantages does this have? Besides dropping around 150.00 for a black powder measure, is there an easier way to measure BP?
I am mainly loading a 500 gr. bullet so what load should I use? mainly shooting 100 to 200 yard range. I know 70 grains of BP is max, and I dont really feel like killing my shoulder with max loads so what is a good mid-range load?
Fillers? I have heard many different things such as cotton, paper, pillow stuffing, corn meal, cream of wheat etc. etc. Now lets say I get a load in there around 50 to 55 grs of BP, I put a cardboard wad on top, then what? Should I use one of the fillers above? and if so what kind of compression should I be looking for when I seat the bullet? Tight, loose, med?
Should I use regular Large rifle primers or magnum?
UGH! any information would be great. Or if you know of a good BP loading manual that you could suggest. The ones I have are from my fathers books and they are dated in the 1960's.
thanks in advance,
Jeff / Slingshot
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| Posted: Wed Apr 22nd, 2009 02:08 PM |
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2nd Post |
Ranch 13
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2f is a good choice for the 45-70. I do prefer Goex Cartridge tho,with Grafs 2f a very close second.
Don't worry about storing bp, as long as its in the can and you're not checking the level of powder in the cans with a match its no more problem to have around than smokeless.
There's no shortage of folks loading and shooting 1000's of bp rounds everyyear that use regular powder measures. Drop tubes help to settle the powder in the case, making more room to start the bullet and the wad. You can get plenty of room in the 45-70 case by just pouring the powder slowly thru the powder funnel.
You'll want to place a wad from something as simple as punched from milk cartons , wax paper or tablet backs, to buying some .030 fiber wads, between the powder and the bullet.
The main thing is to make sure that the bullet makes firm contact with the powder. With most 500 gr bullets that means probably no less than 65 grs of bp. "fillers" are bad juju with bp, if you need to take up more space in the case then you need to use cork or felt wads, or grease cookies.
The recoil from even as much as 75 grs of 3f won't be bad to handle in your rifle.
You'll also want to make sure the bullet are at least .001 over groove diameter, and are lubed with a quality blackpowder bullet lube.
Large pistol or large rifle primers either one are fine. Magnum primers really are a waste with bp.
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| Posted: Sat Jun 6th, 2009 02:57 AM |
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Mike Williams
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Jeff, I agree with Ranch 13 about his suggestions on reloading. I would add that you just make your own droptube using copper tubing for the droptube. You will also need to compress the bp in the cartridge after using the droptube so you need a compression die. I use a .030 wad, 65 grains of 2F Goex, Lg winchester rifle primers and starline 45-70 brass. I weigh my powder charge for more consistanly. I very slightly bell the brass to seat the lubed bullet and set the bullet on the wad leaving no air space. I iron out the bell in the cartridge with a full length resizer die after removing the primer punch. You need to experiment with the OAL of cartridge, powder charge, and possibley bullet weight. I use the Lyman 520 gr govt bullet. I get acceptable accuracy at 100 yd and 200 yd 's. Not BP silouette accuracy but hunting accuracy. You may want to check out Mike Venturino's web site for his reloading the 45-70 rifle. Great infor. Have fun shooting the 45-70 with BP. Reloading with the BP is interesting and traditional. Good shooting, Mike
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| Posted: Fri Nov 13th, 2009 03:07 PM |
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DavidVanVorous
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Slingshot wrote: Hello all,
I am about to venture into some unknown territory. I have limited experience with BP, mostly with muzzleloaders. I wish to reload 45/70 goverment for my Sharps Replica rifle 32" barrel. I am not really impressed by the BP substitues so I plan on using the real deal.
Any storage suggestions? I do not plan on storing my BP in my smokeless powder cabinet and plan on only having a pound or 2 at one time.
What kind of BP 2F, 3F?
I have read a few books and still have some questions. Most say to let the powder flow down a tube approx. 24 - 32" into the case, why? what advantages does this have? Besides dropping around 150.00 for a black powder measure, is there an easier way to measure BP?
I am mainly loading a 500 gr. bullet so what load should I use? mainly shooting 100 to 200 yard range. I know 70 grains of BP is max, and I dont really feel like killing my shoulder with max loads so what is a good mid-range load?
Fillers? I have heard many different things such as cotton, paper, pillow stuffing, corn meal, cream of wheat etc. etc. Now lets say I get a load in there around 50 to 55 grs of BP, I put a cardboard wad on top, then what? Should I use one of the fillers above? and if so what kind of compression should I be looking for when I seat the bullet? Tight, loose, med?
Should I use regular Large rifle primers or magnum?
UGH! any information would be great. Or if you know of a good BP loading manual that you could suggest. The ones I have are from my fathers books and they are dated in the 1960's.
thanks in advance,
Jeff / Slingshot
Simplest way to reduce recoil is to go with a lighter slug like the 420 gr Lyman 457193 (weight varies with alloy from 405 to 420). But BP isnt nearly as annoying on long strings as the recoil is more of a push in comparison to white...
One of my more accurate loads is said slug in front of 70 gr 3f and a .06 wad ignited by a Fed 215M. Just dont compress the load with the slug and it will need to be compressed so I use a compression widget I install in the seater die prior to seating the slug.
D.
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| Posted: Tue Jan 12th, 2010 04:19 PM |
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Irish Bird Dog
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Good advice from the previous posts......Genuine BP is the best way to go and it is usually cheaper per lb. to buy. Drop tube is the way to get the most powder into a case as it helps it to settle in the case as it comes in via the long drop ie 24" =/-. I don't use a powder measure machine anymore, I have found a scoop that I fill by dipping into a large mouthed can of BP (FFg Goex in my case) and keep it level with the top of scoop. I checked the scoop for weight of BP and it is 59gr in my case, that is all I can get in the case for my 535gr Postell bullet. I then compress the powder a specific amount (in fractions of an inch), with a card wad, over the powder, made from pop cartons, cut out with .458 wad cutter & hammer or a special cutter made for my drill press. For a compression die I use the neck expander die from my loading die set (RCBS in my case) use the expander plug for the compression plug, all in an RCBS Jr2 loading press. Then I just push the bullet in by hand and do not crimp the bullet in place. I place loaded cartridges in a box bullet up 'til I use them. This load only for my Browning BPCR HighWall rifle and the same brass used is always from this gun so I don't full length size them. I have opened up the flash hole in the brass with a # drill (can't 'member the drill # right now) for better ignition and I use Federal 215M primers for best ignition. Works well for me out to 600yds +.
As you can see there are many ideas of how to load for a BP cartridge. I can't believe that the buffalo hunters of old were overly careful about measuring the powder charge when they were reloading in the light of a campfire after a hard day of hunting. I'd bet they made a scoop and went at it. Enjoy your new hobby!
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| Posted: Tue Jan 12th, 2010 04:51 PM |
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Ranch 13
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Irish Bird Dog wrote: you can see there are many ideas of how to load for a BP cartridge. I can't believe that the buffalo hunters of old were overly careful about measuring the powder charge when they were reloading in the light of a campfire after a hard day of hunting. I'd bet they made a scoop and went at it. Enjoy your new hobby!
The hide hunters mostly bought their reloading outfits from Sharps,Remington, Maynard or whoever made the rifle. The Sharps reloading kits had a measure made for what ever cartridge the rifle came in.
Many of those old hiders didn't reload they bought their ammo by the case/s.
If you go to Cornell Publishings web page and pick up one of the reprints of the Sharps, and other old manufacturers catalogs, they're a treasure trove of information.
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| Posted: Mon Jan 18th, 2010 07:13 AM |
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pegleg4570
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To compress the load,and seat the card wad I use a piece of Brass shaped the same as my Bullet only about .030 smaller in diameter then you can just push your lubed bullet in by hand on the table edge, and not mess up your seating die.
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| Posted: Sun Feb 28th, 2010 06:13 AM |
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Pete D.
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Seating the bullets by hand is the way to go.
I disagree about using - or not using - fillers in the 45-70 case. A grease cookie, yes, always, but if you are trying to duplicate the old cavalry carbine load of 55 grains BP and a 405 grain bullet, then more is needed than a grease cookie.
A number of shooters that I know use Kapok fiber. Others use Cream of Wheat. I use a filler designed for the purpose called PuffLon. Powder dropped in, grease cookie in, Pufflon to the mouth of the case, seat the bullet, light crimp to hold.
PeteLast edited on Sun Feb 28th, 2010 06:13 AM by Pete D.
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| Posted: Mon Mar 1st, 2010 03:01 AM |
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pegleg4570
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I have used Cream of Wheat before, but I switched to a larger Bullet, and no longer need the space.
Sprays it out there for the birds to eat.
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pegleg4570
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Slingshot,
FFF burns a little cleaner than FF.
Here's a Good Cleaning Solution for Black Powder.
1 pint of Hydrogen Peroxide
1pint of Rubbing Alcohol
1 pint of Murphy's Oil Soap
Just mix together,and store in a bottle that no UV light can get to.
The UV kills the Peroxide. (Clorox Bottles, Peroxide Bottles)
Warm the Barrel with hot water fill the Barrel with Cleaner.
When it quits foaming .....Repeat.
Flush out with hot water, dry,and Oil it you are done.
to protect the finish,and wood here is another recipe...
You need a Double e Boiler, or just put into a Microwave.
Equal parts by weight of Beeswax, and Rendered Lard
( The Red Square Buckets in the Grocery Store).
If you find that this starts to melt in your area then just add more Beeswax.
You can use it on patches, and as a bullet lube too.
It really brings out the grain in wood,and the Cleaner above won't hurt it either.
These are some Old Reliable s from Friendship Indiana.
 2
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