| Posted: Fri Dec 19th, 2008 03:45 PM |
|
1st Post |
Oldrockchucker
HB Pro Staff
| Joined: | Thu May 15th, 2008 |
| Location: | Wisconsin USA |
| Posts: | 77 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! | | My favorite chambering is:: | |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
Sorry if this question has been asked before.
Given normal loads, not sizzlers, and normal cleaning and maintenance, how long can one expect a centerfire (.30 cal) or for that matter a rimfire .22 barrel to last in terms of rounds fired. I've read a couple of times in blast and cast magazines, from big name writers, that one shouldn't expect much more than 2000 rounds before accuracy begins to noticably fall off to the point that one should consider getting rebarreled. That just doesn't seem reasonable in my mind.
____________________
Proud to be a NRA member!
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 19th, 2008 03:51 PM |
|
2nd Post |
klallen
Board Founder
| Joined: | Thu Feb 10th, 2005 |
| Location: | Great Falls, Montana USA |
| Posts: | 1188 |
| Photo: | [Download] | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! | | My favorite chambering is:: | Warbirdz Rule |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
answer to the question is going to depend greatly on the .30cal cartridge you're using. no matter if it's a "normal" load or not. a normal load in a .308 treats a barrel much differently then a normal load in a 7.82 Warbird.
the 2000 round expectation sounds reasonable for very large powder capacity rounds. move down the cartridge scale and you're expected round count should increase. i heard a fella say he had upwards of 8ooo rounds through a .308 and was still getting the accuracy he enjoyed from the get go.
____________________
A Big Mouth Don't Make A Big Man !!!
THE DUKE
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 19th, 2008 06:10 PM |
|
3rd Post |
Bigdog57
Handloading Master
| Joined: | Thu Oct 30th, 2008 |
| Location: | Tallahassee, Florida USA |
| Posts: | 969 |
| Photo: | [Download] | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! | | My favorite chambering is:: | |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
.22 Rimfire - forever - you can't shoot enough to wear it out, given proper cleaning and maintenance.
Most 'shot out' barrels are simply dirty and leaded.
____________________
NRA Life Member, USAF 76-80, USN 80-86
Lifelong Florida Cracker!
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 19th, 2008 09:04 PM |
|
4th Post |
saddlesore
HB certified Master Handloading and Ballistics advisor
| Joined: | Sun Feb 6th, 2005 |
| Location: | Colorado Springs, Colorado USA |
| Posts: | 641 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | | | My favorite chambering is:: | |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
In center fire cartridges,even std loads ,rapid fire can do a lot of barrle damage quickly.I 'd say a stdd 300 win mag,std loads, with a lot of rapid fire,you might not get 2000. Std rate of fire, probably in excess of that. I had one7 x 57 that I ran 600 rds though it juts working up al oad and I'm sure it will be good for 3000
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 19th, 2008 11:57 PM |
|
5th Post |
72coupe
HB certified Master Handloading and Ballistics advisor
| Joined: | Sun Jun 11th, 2006 |
| Location: | Iowa Park, Texas USA |
| Posts: | 2017 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | | | My favorite chambering is:: | |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
I have some experience with 223, 2-250, 308 & 30/06. I have kept careful barrel logs and accuracy records.
223 will last up to 10,000 rounds
22-250 will last 2,500 to 3,000 rounds before it begins to keyhole.
308 will last 5,000 but not much more.
30/06 will also last 5,000.
This is with Krieger barrels, thats about all I shoot.
____________________
Reloader since 1969.
|
| Posted: Sat Dec 20th, 2008 03:49 PM |
|
6th Post |
sako06
Moderator
| Joined: | Sun Jul 22nd, 2007 |
| Location: | California USA |
| Posts: | 867 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! | | My favorite chambering is:: | |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
Three of us LE officers participated in a garand qualification match at the Hi Desert Gun Club in Yucca Valley in the late 1970's.We watched an older man shoot his 1903 Springfield 30-06 at the 100 yard range using 600 yard simulator targets whether sitting, standing or prone in slow fire or rapid fire he put all of his shots on all of the targets in the 10 ring & a few in the 9 ring.We asked him about his rifle so he told us he had fired in excess of 50,000 rounds thru it in practice and competition earning 2 emblems on his shooting coat National High Powder Rifle Champion in 1950 & 1951 he also told us he only had about 6 inches of rifling left near the muzzle.Where everyone gets their information about barrel life accuracy is a mystery to me after witnessing the above event .
|
| Posted: Sun Dec 21st, 2008 12:06 PM |
|
7th Post |
Oddbod
HB Pro Staff
| Joined: | Sun Jan 20th, 2008 |
| Location: | United Kingdom |
| Posts: | 94 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | rifle | | My favorite chambering is:: | |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
There are more barrels ruined by incorrect cleaning than there are worn out through shooting.
A friend has a 220 Swift with more than 5,000 rounds through it & it still shoots ½" groups, despite obvious erosion of the first inch or so of rifling at the throat.
|
| Posted: Sun Dec 21st, 2008 01:58 PM |
|
8th Post |
72coupe
HB certified Master Handloading and Ballistics advisor
| Joined: | Sun Jun 11th, 2006 |
| Location: | Iowa Park, Texas USA |
| Posts: | 2017 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | | | My favorite chambering is:: | |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
I have had 22-250 barrels that would shoot 5 shot groups at 100 yards of less than an inch even though 3 of the bullets went throught the target side ways.
I have no experience with 220 Swift but if he has 5000 rounds on it and only 1 inch of rilfing is gone he must be shooting 22 Hornet loads in it.
____________________
Reloader since 1969.
|
| Posted: Sun Dec 21st, 2008 02:22 PM |
|
9th Post |
barebackpat
Handloading Master
| Joined: | Mon Jan 22nd, 2007 |
| Location: | Two Dot, Montana USA |
| Posts: | 462 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! | | My favorite chambering is:: | |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
On the subject has anyone heard of the the new ceramic coating to put on your ammo and fire through your gun and prolong the barrel life and fps. I was curios i saw it in one of the gun rags i will try and look up some more specific info and pass it along.
____________________
IF there is lead in the air there's Hope!
|
| Posted: Mon Dec 22nd, 2008 02:49 AM |
|
10th Post |
DesertMarine
Moderator
| Joined: | Wed Nov 12th, 2008 |
| Location: | New Mexico USA |
| Posts: | 549 |
| Photo: | [Download] | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | rifle | | My favorite chambering is:: | |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
I looked up the ceramic coatings. It is manufactured by Otis Technology, Inc. Website is http://www.otisgun.com. I had never heard of it but I don't read up on new gun stuff like I used to. Sounds like the claims for moly coating bullets. Anybody use it yet?
____________________
DesertMarine
|
| Posted: Mon Dec 22nd, 2008 03:36 AM |
|
11th Post |
sako06
Moderator
| Joined: | Sun Jul 22nd, 2007 |
| Location: | California USA |
| Posts: | 867 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! | | My favorite chambering is:: | |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
Otis gun cleaning kits I have one nothing on ceramic bullet coatings.Bench Rest Central Forums has info on bullet coatings such as boron nitride bullet coatings. Last edited on Mon Dec 22nd, 2008 03:40 AM by sako06
|
| Posted: Mon Dec 22nd, 2008 10:09 PM |
|
12th Post |
LilMag
Guest
| Joined: | |
| Location: | |
| Posts: | |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | | | My favorite chambering is:: | |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
Oldrockchucker.......I give you what I know about barrel life in a .30 caliber like the 30-06 Springfield. However, I am not sure what you call accuracy etc in the life of that barrel. Now for instance, if your 30-06 shot 2 inch groups at 100 yards from the bench, I would expect it to still be shooting 2 inch groups with factory loaded ammo to about 5000 or 6000 rounds before it started shooting 3 inch groups.
I once had a model 788 Remington that I put 1,220 rounds down the barrel. It shot 1/2 inch groups but went to 1 inch groups at 1050 rounds. Then it started to branch out a little more to 1.25 inches. I then traded the rifle off on a 6mm Remington BDL bull barrel. I have put to date some 4000 rounds down that barrel and it still shoots tight groups with my handloads.
I was once told that the M1 Garand we shot in the service were used heavy by recuits and they had an average of 7,000 rounds or better on them at that time. My M1 shot 1.4 inch groups from the bench at 100 yards with military ammo. On the other end of the spectrum, my friend of years ago, who had a .220 Swift and shot his own reloads, went through a barrel after 800 rounds. He always loaded his loads hot! He also had a .264 Winchester Magnum that went 2000 rounds before the barrel went out on it shooting 3 inch groups at 125 yards behind the barn.
I have a .300 Ultra mag but I don't expect to get the life out of the barrel, that I have with my first .300 Win mag of years ago. Some calibers simply eroe throats and wear out barrels faster than others do.
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 23rd, 2008 12:21 AM |
|
13th Post |
nksmfamjp
HB Pro Staff
| Joined: | Sun Jun 29th, 2008 |
| Location: | |
| Posts: | 53 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! | | My favorite chambering is:: | |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
What is wore out to you? 1" at 100 yards? 10" at 100 yards?
A barrel wears by eating the throat with high pressure gases. Ususally a wore out barrel can be resored to acceptable accuracy with a shorten, recrown, rechamber. Now, it is hard to find someone who wants to put that kind of work into a factory barrel, but people do buy used benchrest barrels which are wore out at .25" groups at 100 yards. They rechamber and recrown to have a varmint tackdriver for a reasonable price.
I don't know if you can ever actually wear out the rifling, except in the throat, even with a barrel burner like 22-250, 270 WSM or 17 Rem.
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 23rd, 2008 02:07 AM |
|
14th Post |
72coupe
HB certified Master Handloading and Ballistics advisor
| Joined: | Sun Jun 11th, 2006 |
| Location: | Iowa Park, Texas USA |
| Posts: | 2017 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | | | My favorite chambering is:: | |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
While it is common practice to set back the barrel on bolt actions, most of the rifles I own are semiautos. They cannot as a practical matter be set back.
From what I have read 2 set backs and rechambering is the limit because of overall wear.
Again the definition of accuracy comes into play and your definition also determines your barrel life.
____________________
Reloader since 1969.
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 23rd, 2008 03:50 AM |
|
15th Post |
miestro_jerry
Guest
| Joined: | |
| Location: | |
| Posts: | |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | | | My favorite chambering is:: | |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
I have been shooting rim fire and center fire since I was 14. The only barrels that I have worn out were ones like the 220 Swift, but I hear they changed things with those barrels to give them longer service life.
When I was a recruit in the Army, I started out on the M 14, finest rifle I have ever really known. Why are they re-issuing them these days? But what I saw of them, they did get heavy use way back when, are all of them being re barreled and rebuilt?
My Springfield M1As never seem to wear out, but I generally sell them at 10K usage and buy the next better one that Springfield makes. Right now I actually have three M1As and a Fulton Armory M14, as that these all have been built since the current war started, there doesn't seem to be a parts shortage.
I have a 300 Ultra Mag and I bought it on the basis that it will burn the barrel out, that is a really hard firing big honkin' gun for a 30 cal. When I can't see any rifling, I will buy a new barrel and probably a new stock for it.
22 Rim fires that I have owned and used, lets see Grandpa's octagonal barrels pump gun killed squirrels when it 70 years old and all of my great uncles, uncles and some of my cousins abused it, it still shooting fine these days with a 2 or 3 cousin. I have had the Nylon 66, a Winchester model 59 and 190, a Walther Sports Model 22, lots of Marlins bolt guns, an Anschutz or two, right now I have a Mossberg Model 46, and a 10/22 Target grade. I seem to sell them, trade them, what ever for something else that interests me. Never wore one out.
But I must say that I have seen many military 1911a with badly worn barrels in them, so corrosive powder/primer and improper cleaning, as well as over use will wear out or kill a barrel.
Merry Christmas,
Jerry
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 23rd, 2008 06:11 AM |
|
16th Post |
Timberwolf
HB Pro Staff
| Joined: | Mon Nov 24th, 2008 |
| Location: | Ontario Canada |
| Posts: | 154 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! | | My favorite chambering is:: | |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
Many manufacturers state that the barrel life only between 3-5K rounds.
I say bollocks. My Rem 700 in .308 had over 7K rounds through it and I still get .25" if I do my part.
____________________
Nice try = you suck spelled different.
Certified Armourer for Glock, SIG, S&W, Beretta and Remington 870.
Stercus Accidit = Sh*t happens in Latin.
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 23rd, 2008 02:44 PM |
|
17th Post |
Oldrockchucker
HB Pro Staff
| Joined: | Thu May 15th, 2008 |
| Location: | Wisconsin USA |
| Posts: | 77 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! | | My favorite chambering is:: | |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
Thanks for all your responses. It helps me put a perspective on barrel life.
BTW, the .30 cal rifles I'm talking about (I never mentioned in my previous post) are 30/30 (Marlin) and 30/06 (Rem700, BAR and Rem760).
Last edited on Tue Dec 23rd, 2008 02:48 PM by Oldrockchucker
____________________
Proud to be a NRA member!
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 24th, 2008 01:57 AM |
|
18th Post |
miestro_jerry
Guest
| Joined: | |
| Location: | |
| Posts: | |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | | | My favorite chambering is:: | |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
I had a Marlin 30-30 that was a bunch of years old and the barrel had some pitting, but was still very accurate. I replaced it with a newer Marlin 336 that is in excellent condition. For the Marlin you may want to talk to the people over on the Marlin forum:
http://www.marlinowners.com/forums/
A long time ago I had a BDL in .243, I didn't wear the barrel out or have receiver errosion on it after many years of shooting both jacketed and cast bullets thru it. I traded it for another rifle.
I did gave a Savage 110 in 308 that the bore was very worn, I got it used for $100, I shoot oversized cast bullets thru it with no problems. I sized them to .311.
The care of the barrel and receiver is what will make them last the longest, a good cleaning evry time you handle it and not shooting extremely hot or corrosive ammo thru it.
Jerry
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 24th, 2008 10:01 AM |
|
19th Post |
Bigdog57
Handloading Master
| Joined: | Thu Oct 30th, 2008 |
| Location: | Tallahassee, Florida USA |
| Posts: | 969 |
| Photo: | [Download] | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! | | My favorite chambering is:: | |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
My only rifle with a truly bad bore is my Finnish M39 Mosin - normally considered the best and most accurate of all the Mosin variants. I call mine the "Prom Queen with bad teeth", as outwardly it's a beautiful rifle, lovely tiger-flamed arctic birch stock, good metal. But..... the bore is very pitted, especially near the muzzle - I can see some very poor rifling in the rear half of the barrel. I figure some prior owner shot it a lot with corrosive ammo and didn't clean properly - not that it was 'shot out'.
One of my early surplus buys before I really knew what to look for.
Still, it'll shoot passably well with the heavy 204-grain softpoints. With the surplus ammo, it is more a .311 shotgun..... 
____________________
NRA Life Member, USAF 76-80, USN 80-86
Lifelong Florida Cracker!
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 24th, 2008 01:24 PM |
|
20th Post |
72coupe
HB certified Master Handloading and Ballistics advisor
| Joined: | Sun Jun 11th, 2006 |
| Location: | Iowa Park, Texas USA |
| Posts: | 2017 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | | | My favorite chambering is:: | |
| Status: |
Offline
|
back to top
|
Bigdog57 wrote: My only rifle with a truly bad bore is my Finnish M39 Mosin - normally considered the best and most accurate of all the Mosin variants. I call mine the "Prom Queen with bad teeth", as outwardly it's a beautiful rifle, lovely tiger-flamed arctic birch stock, good metal. But..... the bore is very pitted, especially near the muzzle - I can see some very poor rifling in the rear half of the barrel. I figure some prior owner shot it a lot with corrosive ammo and didn't clean properly - not that it was 'shot out'.
One of my early surplus buys before I really knew what to look for.
Still, it'll shoot passably well with the heavy 204-grain softpoints. With the surplus ammo, it is more a .311 shotgun.....
Numrich sells replacement barrels. I think they are $39.95.
____________________
Reloader since 1969.
|
| Current time is 08:34 PM | Page: 1 2   |
|
