| Posted: Thu Jun 11th, 2009 04:47 PM |
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klallen
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morning fellas. for those of you who might be loading a 230 gr. personal defense type bullet (gold dot, golden saber, xtp and the like) for the .45acp in semiauto handguns with barrels shorter then 5", could you take a moment and post your prefered load (components, velocity)?
i'm currently working up a load using the 230 gr. golden saber, cci300's and blue dot. i'm not really happy with what i'm seeing to this point, performance wise and am trying to figure out if it's component related or simply the length of the barrel that's holding things back. i am considering component changes ... possibly a mag primer to see if that steps things up a bit; a lighter bullet maybe; different powder (but would prefer staying with blue dot).
thanks. korey
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| Posted: Thu Jun 11th, 2009 06:29 PM |
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NoQuarter
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Cant help with the blue dot Korey, but when I started loading 230xtp loads, could not get good velocity untill i tightened up my crimp to FIRM. Was about to give up before that. I use W LP primers, and 4.9. bullseye, . I seat at 1.201 very accurate Hope this helps.
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| Posted: Thu Jun 11th, 2009 10:14 PM |
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rg1
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Give up on the Blue Dot. It's never going to work in your .45. I suggest switching to Unique powder. I have very good results in a 3.9" barreled Sig 45ACP using either CCI 300's or RP 2 1/2 primers and shooting Rem 230 Golden Sabers. I've used Win, RP, and other cases
I suggest starting loads with Unique at 6.0 grains and work up to a maximum of 6.7. My load that I use uses 6.5 grains of Unique. 6.7 grains is "supposed" to be a factory velocity duplication load and it is pretty stout but showed no problems or pressure signs. Just work up from 6.0 grains to the level you're satisfied with and your gun likes. Factory Remington 230 GS's measure 1.235" overall length. Varies a little due to the irregular hollowpoint tip shape. Very lightly taper crimp just to remove any belling of the case mouth. At 1.235" oal the driving band will be inside the case mouth and the taper crimp would look like the mouth is barely touching the smaller diameter of the bullet. The Golden Saber with the driving band takes a little more powder to get the same velocity and pressure as a copper jacketed bullet. Some say it takes .2 more grains with their loads. Do start at 5.9-6.0 grains of Unique and work up to the higher levels. I found this info on a ballistics site that is no longer on the net and carefully worked up and found their info to be correct. It's a shame no powder company nor Remington publishes data for a very good bullet. DO NOT use the above data with OTHER bullets but use published data!!!
Accurate #5 works well with my Hornady 230 XTP loads in different pistols. I've shot the Unique loads in Colt 1911's, Glocks, and the new Sig 220 Carry. Hey, my sister-in-law is from Great Falls. Wife spent a summer there. Last name Sutton married to a Terry. Thought you might know them?
Last edited on Thu Jun 11th, 2009 10:47 PM by rg1
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| Posted: Fri Jun 12th, 2009 02:04 AM |
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klallen
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thanks for the info, guys.
rg, how bout a velocity for your prefered unique load? i used to live next to a sutton family out in the sun river valley when i was younger. don't know if they're the same suttons of which you speak. that was a loooooong time ago.
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| Posted: Fri Jun 12th, 2009 02:21 AM |
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swampshooter
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I've spent a lot of time reloading for the .45 acp. In my experience Blue Dot is too slow. I've had best luck with Bullseye in short barrels, along with International Clays. Unique is very good in a 5", but I've never shot it in a short barrel. I'd try something with a burning rate between Bullseye and Unique.
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| Posted: Fri Jun 12th, 2009 03:03 AM |
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RobertMT
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I have a Taurus 45acp 4" barrel, I don't have chrony, I test my defensive loads on deer.
200 XTP over 6gr bullseye, CCI 300, 1.2" COL; 1st test WT buck 27 yds DRT , not quite full penetration, but hit shoulder blade joint on way through. 2d test WT doe 30 yds DTR, full penetration.
A little dirty, but not bad. I've tried greendot, didn't like it dirty and hard metering. Firm crimp, Lee factory crimp die, seemed to help on powder burn in 4" barrel.
Last edited on Fri Jun 12th, 2009 03:50 AM by RobertMT
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| Posted: Fri Jun 12th, 2009 06:35 AM |
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rg1
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I get approx. 780-790 fps in the 3.9" barrel with 6.5 grains. 6.7 grains gets 800-820 fps. 6.7 in a 5" 1911 will get 850fps. Haven't chrono'd a lot with the 3.9" barrel, just a few shots in the new to me Sig 220 Carry.
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| Posted: Fri Jun 12th, 2009 02:04 PM |
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miestro_jerry
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I shoot the same loads in my little Kimber Pro Carry II as my full size 1911s. I don't expect the smaller pistol to be as accurate as the full size ones, but some people have told me that the Pro Carry II can be as accurate as the full size pistols.
For close range and near hand to hand combat, the little Kimber is one of my pistols of choice to carry.
Jerry
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| Posted: Fri Jun 12th, 2009 08:34 PM |
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caz223
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Believe it.
Blue dot is too slow for .45, and you won't even get good sealing. at those low pressures.
Unique is my favorite, but I prefer 200 grain bullets, which seems to agree with unique. I use +p type loads, so I'm not gonna put the powder weight in here, should accidents happen.....
For more velocity from short barrels, try a fast powder, or you'll be wasting your efforts in velocity in just making a fireball.
Bullseye/clays is about where you want to be for short barrels and 230 grain bullets in .45 acp.
I prefer 200 grain bullets and 4" barrels in .45, so unique/power pistol/WSF are the range I want to be in.
I also don't mind a little fireball, as they're not defense loads.
Last edited on Fri Jun 12th, 2009 08:36 PM by caz223
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| Posted: Sat Jul 25th, 2009 05:22 PM |
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BeaverJack
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For a short barreled 45 acp, you can't do better than VV N310 or N320. N310 is about the same burn rate as Bullseye, but much cleaner with no flash. Since most SD encounters are in low light, your followup shots will largely depend on muzzle flash impeding your reacquisition of the sights and target.
BTW, the Hornady 200 XTP is a real good bullet for what you're trying to do. Try it with N320. Bill Wilson's load is 6.3 grains, but work up to that level since it is +P. I carry 6.1 grains under a 200 XTP in my Commander, and I'm convinced there is not a better SD load out there in terms of accuracy, velocity, and low flash.
Last edited on Sat Jul 25th, 2009 05:27 PM by BeaverJack
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| Posted: Tue Sep 29th, 2009 03:43 AM |
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fastlane1986
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I have a 3.5" SA Compact and I've been using 7.2gr of HS-6 under a 230gr HP-XTP with very good results. I get acceptable expansion and very good accuracy with very mild recoil. Some migh consider this load light but it allows for a very fast follow up shot. I've loaded all the way up to 8.0gr but I'm all over the target with powder charges in 7.7 - 8.0 range so I wouldn't recommend them for SD.
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| Posted: Tue Sep 29th, 2009 03:52 AM |
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miestro_jerry
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Any one try Autocomp in these short barreled 1911s? I will probably load some up especially for my little Kimber and see what it can do or don't do.
Jerry
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| Posted: Tue Sep 29th, 2009 01:27 PM |
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40twist
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For my plinking 45 rounds , which would be 230 gr hp/xtp because they were free , I worked up a very light load with titegroup. I use 4.2 gr at 1.200 and that is very soft shooting , clean and accurate. Any lower than that and I dont get a good seal.
When I want to hop things up a bit I use bullseye. I have alot of 185gr and 230 gr hp/xtp and bullseye like them both. I use titegroup most because its cleaner
ETA : +1 on the firm crimp .... Lee FC die 
Last edited on Tue Sep 29th, 2009 01:28 PM by 40twist
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| Posted: Tue Sep 29th, 2009 02:25 PM |
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fastlane1986
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What is your charge weight for the 185gr hp/xtp with Bullseye? Any idea of that the fps might be with this load?
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| Posted: Tue Sep 29th, 2009 04:54 PM |
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miestro_jerry
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Fastlane,
This is a range for you to try
185 JHP with Bullseye in a short barreled 45 ACP, 1911
Start FPS MAX FPS
3.8gr 550 6.0gr 890
All disclaimers apply
Hope this helps,
Jerry
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| Posted: Tue Sep 29th, 2009 05:28 PM |
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fastlane1986
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Thanks, any recommendations for the Titegroup and the 185gr hp/xtp? I don't recall seeing anything published from either Hodgdon or Hornady on that combo.
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| Posted: Tue Sep 29th, 2009 06:11 PM |
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miestro_jerry
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Lets see for Titegroup powder
185 Grain JHP
Start FPS MAX FPS
4.5gr 720 5.6 875
This powder has a very narrow range of loads for the short barreled 1911s. Thisw worked great in my little Kimber, but slammed the slide hard when it cycyled on a friends Taurus.
Usual disclaimers
Hope this helps,
Jerry
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| Posted: Tue Sep 29th, 2009 07:32 PM |
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40twist
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fastlane1986 wrote: Thanks, any recommendations for the Titegroup and the 185gr hp/xtp? I don't recall seeing anything published from either Hodgdon or Hornady on that combo.
I use 4.9
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| Posted: Tue Sep 29th, 2009 08:25 PM |
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fastlane1986
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Thank you miestro_jerry and 40twist. I haven't done much with Titegroup, although I've heard it's a fine powder, so I'll pick a can and give it a try. If your recommendations work out, I'd be able to squeeze a couple hundred more rounds out of a 1 lb. can of powder versus the HS-6.
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Tip Top Ranch
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6.5 gr of AutoComp works well with a 230 gr Cast RN out of a Springfield XD.
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