| Posted: Thu Oct 29th, 2009 01:36 AM |
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patriot7
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What criteria qualifies a cartridge as a magnum?
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| Posted: Thu Oct 29th, 2009 01:46 AM |
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fryboy
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the word overbore comes to mind,
try readin this link ( they explain it better than i )
http://accurateshooter.wordpress.com/2008/05/05/overbore-cartridges-a-working-definition/
other than that iz just a name , some rounds that can be deemed mags arent and some are that really arent
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| Posted: Thu Oct 29th, 2009 01:47 AM |
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300 SAUM
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Years ago if it was a belted case it was a magnum, however my personal view on "MAGNUMS" would be due to the amount of powder the case can hold as opposed to your average normal round.
IE: .44 special / .44 magnum
7mm-08 / 7mm Magnum
Just my personal opinion,... 
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| Posted: Thu Oct 29th, 2009 02:32 AM |
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Thecyberguy
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BIGGER BANG ?????
Guy
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| Posted: Thu Oct 29th, 2009 02:40 AM |
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MontanaShooter
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a souped up engine versus a stock engine. Kinda like puttin a racin cam and a 4 barrel on a ford Pinto :) yeah i know there prob a one barrel but lets not nit pick.
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| Posted: Thu Oct 29th, 2009 03:24 AM |
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Charley
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Usually the guys in advertisng/promotions decide on the name. Magnum sells to rubes.
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| Posted: Thu Oct 29th, 2009 03:54 AM |
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klallen
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probably based on performance more then anything else. you take the top performing 3, 4, 5 or so cartridges of a particular caliber class, they're a magnum cartridge. large powder capacities. heavy for caliber bullets moving fast. better ballistics. top end energy levels at muzzle and retained downrange. performance would be my #1 criteria for defining a magnum cartridge. k
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| Posted: Thu Oct 29th, 2009 05:07 AM |
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Don Fischer
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A magnum is a very large case for the caliber. Origionally magnum's came with belted cases and were easily identified. I think I read that the word was borrowed from a magnum of champaine, it's much larger than a reg bottle.
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| Posted: Thu Oct 29th, 2009 06:35 AM |
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MontanaShooter
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not neccessarily larger case look at the 357 and the 38 or the 44 special or 44 magnum a few thousandts difference. Rifle magnums have belts most the time for headspacing as ive been told more so than strength. Maybe wrong on that though cause it is a huge controversy. Most magnum revolver rounds are just heavier powder charges in strengthened cylinders. Theres no real "magnum" definition, generally speaking in my opinion it is most the time a improved exsisting round. Otherwise generally speaking what would it be magnumed in comparison to itd just be another round. Most magnums the root cartridge is easily identified. Of course the 300 win mag i couldnt say what it is a mag of, id be willing to bet theres something though and i am sure someone here knows.
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| Posted: Thu Oct 29th, 2009 06:35 AM |
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MontanaShooter
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not neccessarily larger case look at the 357 and the 38 or the 44 special or 44 magnum a few thousandts difference. Rifle magnums have belts most the time for headspacing as ive been told more so than strength. Maybe wrong on that though cause it is a huge controversy. Most magnum revolver rounds are just heavier powder charges in strengthened cylinders. Theres no real "magnum" definition, generally speaking in my opinion it is most the time a improved exsisting round. Otherwise generally speaking what would it be magnumed in comparison to itd just be another round. Most magnums the root cartridge is easily identified. Of course the 300 win mag i couldnt say what it is a mag of, id be willing to bet theres someone though and i am sure someone here knows. Last edited on Thu Oct 29th, 2009 06:36 AM by
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| Posted: Thu Oct 29th, 2009 01:06 PM |
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Rockydog
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Montana, The .300 win Mag uses a .300 H&H case as it's base. This case was the base for most mag rifle cartridges until the alphabet cartridges came along. RD
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| Posted: Thu Oct 29th, 2009 05:28 PM |
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Paul B
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Rockydog wrote: Montana, The .300 win Mag uses a .300 H&H case as it's base. This case was the base for most mag rifle cartridges until the alphabet cartridges came along. RD
Not quite accurate. The .375 H&H magnum came first anf the .300 H&H was not even called a magnum, but rather the .300 H&H Super 30. Ballistics were exactly the same as the 30-06. They used the larger case because the preferred powder in Great bitain was cordite which could develop dangerous pressures under tropical heat. Power levels were raised here in the states because American made powders were not as problematic in hot weather compared to cordite.
However, the first belted cartridge was not even a magnum but a fairly slow moving medium bore round called the .400/.375 Beltes Nitro-Express (H&H) or .375 H&H Velopex. There wasn't enough shoulder so H&H "invented" the belt for headspacing purposes. Velocity with a 270 gr. bullet was 2175 FPS. (from COW)
The proper name for the .375 H&H Mag. is .375 Belted Rimless Magnum Nirto-Express. It was us Americans that changed the name to .375 H&H Magnum.
I've never figured out what the fuss was all about on the belt. It's simple enough to set up a sizing die so that the round headspaces on the shoulder even with the comparatively small shoulder of the .300 H&H.
Sometime, one should measure the belts on magnum brass. There's enough variation on those belts to create a headspace problem already. Good enough for the first shot, but not good enough unless one sets up the dies to eliminate the problem. I've measured belts on new brass that varied by .010". Anythng over .006" is considered excessive headspace.
Paul B.
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| Posted: Thu Oct 29th, 2009 11:28 PM |
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Offfhand
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Funny question, funnier answers. Most are almost correct, depending on sources. Weatherby didn't invent the name of course, but he put it in our jargon, just like some British arms/ammo makers made "Nitro Express" an impressive sounding title. It once meant something, but no longer. Nowadays, if an ammo maker wants to call their new baby a "Magnum" it's their call, but really doesn't mean much except in their catalogs and advets.
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| Posted: Fri Oct 30th, 2009 12:11 AM |
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miestro_jerry
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But which kind of "magnum" we have Maximums, Super Magnums, Ultra Magnums and probably a few other I can't remember at the moment.
What about the inverse, sub magnums?
Jerry
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| Posted: Fri Oct 30th, 2009 01:00 AM |
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MontanaShooter
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i might also add that the 44 magnum and the 357 magnum are only slighty longer to prevent chambering them in the non magnum predecessors. I never claim anything i say to be written in stone truth cause honostly most of it ive learned by word of mouth so i cant give anyone a figure or index for everything. And of course just cause you read it dont mean its true either,(esp liberal newspapers :) ) but anyhows it makes sense to me anyways. That doesnt mean though that you cant fit a 357 in a 38 revolver:) a few idiots have done it from what i hear. If you do dont strike the primer with the ball peen hammer your using to make it fit:) not that it would make much difference it suicide either way.
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| Posted: Fri Oct 30th, 2009 02:17 AM |
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RaySendero
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patriot7 wrote: What criteria qualifies a cartridge as a magnum?
Patriot,
Looks like you got some general answers to a general question.
Was/Is there something more specific (a certain cartridge) you had in mind?
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| Posted: Fri Oct 30th, 2009 02:33 AM |
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patriot7
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You guys are killing me!!! LOL!!! I think you guys have pretty much covered it. You've got to admit it was a good question and I'll have more for you.
Thanks everybody for your input.
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| Posted: Fri Oct 30th, 2009 08:37 AM |
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fryboy
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actually amigo it's a question we rarely think of ,experience shows us that magnums are anything from a name to a hot loading of another round ( ie;44 special vs 44 mag)but here's the free dictionary's e-finition
mag·num (mgnm)
n.
1. A bottle, holding about two fifths of a gallon (1.5 liters), for wine or liquor.
2. The amount of liquid that this bottle can hold.
3. A magnum cartridge or firearm.
adj.
1. Of or relating to a cartridge containing a larger explosive charge than other cartridges of the same size.
2. Designed to shoot magnum cartridges.
[From Latin, neuter of magnus, great; see meg- in Indo-European roots.]
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| Posted: Fri Oct 30th, 2009 05:34 PM |
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Dirtkicker
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Marketing.
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| Posted: Fri Oct 30th, 2009 07:36 PM |
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Offfhand
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Next time you hear someone telling how powerful "Magnum" calibers are just politely ask how many elephants and cape buffalo have been killed with the .17 HMR(Hornady MAGNUM Rimfire.), not to mention the even more awesome, bone shattering.22WMR.
Have a nice weekend everybody.
Offfhand
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