The Handloaders Bench Home

Search
   
Members

Calendar

Help

Home
Search by username
Not logged in - Login | Register 


Moly Bullets
 Moderated by: klallen  

New Topic

Reply

Print
AuthorPost
Parsec
HB Pro Staff


Joined: 22 September 2007
Location: British Columbia Canada
Posts: 89
Photo: 
Are you a handloader?: Yes
Favorite type of cartridge to load?: rifle
Status:  Offline
 Posted: 15 July 2008 03:57 AM

Quote

Reply
I was told that there is a custom barrel maker in the U.S. who says on their website that using moly coated bullets in a new barrel can result in a barrel splitting. The 3rd hand story goes something like this: If there is the slightest imperfection in the barrel where moly can accumulate it will continue to acrete onto itself and cause enough of a restriction that one day the bullet will not be able to pass through and the resultant pressure will split the barrel.

Has anyone else read or heard of this and if this is true wouldn't that make older barrels even more susceptable to this kind of damage? 

I have some moly Amax's that I was going to use in my AG42b but now I'm kinda hanging back....

dakotasin
Board Founder


Joined: 8 February 2005
Location: Dizzy City, Wyoming USA
Posts: 591
Photo: 
Are you a handloader?: Yes
Favorite type of cartridge to load?: rifle
Status:  Online
 Posted: 15 July 2008 06:49 AM

Quote

Reply
never heard of it and don't believe it.

i went thru a period of 2 or 3 years where i would only shoot moly. that was when i was shooting purely off the rack remingtons and savages, and included several prairie dog shoots. point being, the story does not and would not concern me even a little.



____________________
Hunting is not a matter of life or death; it is much more important than that!

woodsman777
HB Full Member


Joined: 30 May 2008
Location: Washington USA
Posts: 84
Photo: [Download]
Are you a handloader?: Yes
Favorite type of cartridge to load?: I load everything!
Status:  Offline
 Posted: 15 July 2008 10:31 AM

Quote

Reply
the rumor kinda goes contrary to what the stuff is suppose to do ,it took them years to work out a formula that would stick to anything much less itself ?

Moly Questions & Answers







MOLYBDENUM DISULFIDE (MOLY ULTRA-COAT)

Molybdenum disulfide or "Moly", as it is commonly called, is a lubricant used in extreme pressure conditions due to its high degree of lubricity and high melting point. Moly has been found to reduce bore fouling when applied to bullet surfaces. It will decrease bore cleaning effort and time. Published reports have shown an increase in Ballistic Coefficient, longer barrel life, and an increase in accuracy.

Moly coated bullets will reduce pressure and velocity. Loads must be worked up slowly to attain previous velocities, therefore this does NOT mean powder can be added indiscriminately. The maximum pressure of the cartridge must not be exceeded under any circumstances.

LOADING DATA FOR MOLY COATED BULLETS AND NON-MOLY COATED BULLETS IS NOT INTERCHANGEABLE

Below are questions concerning Moly coating that MidwayUSA customers have been asking with technical advice for each:

Do I need steel shot?
  1. Steel shot is not needed in the MidwayUSA process.
  2. Steel shot is used in other processes as a burnishing aid to imbed the Moly into the bullet surface.
  3. By using the MidwayUSA 1292 Tumbler, bullet on bullet impact imbeds Moly into the bullet surface without the use of steel shot.
Do I need carnauba wax?
  1. Carnauba wax is not needed.
  2. Carnauba wax is used in other processes so the Moly would not rub off the bullets.
  3. Some shooters using carnauba wax have found that the wax accumulates in the bore and crystallizes.
How many bullets can I coat?
  1. A. An 8 oz container will coat approximately 970 lbs of jacketed bullets or 485 lbs of cast lead bullets.
  2. B. The maximum load for a MidwayUSA 1292 Tumbler is 10 lbs.
Do cast lead bullets still need to be lubed?
  1. Yes. Even though cast lead bullets have been Moly-coated they still must be lubed after Moly coating.
  2. If Midway pre-sized and lubed cast bullets are being Moly-coated freeze the bullets for two hours then tumble with Moly for 20 minutes.
Why do I need different bowls for coating jacketed and cast lead bullets?
  1. When coating cast lead bullets or bullets with exposed lead (i.e. soft points, spitzers) a layer of lead is deposited on the surface of the bowl. This layer of lead can then be transferred to a bullet’s copper jacket or plating causing the Moly not to adhere.
  2. Bowls used for coating bullets with exposed lead (i.e. soft points, spitzers) should be cleaned after each use.
  3. Bowls used for coating cast lead bullets should be cleaned after coating 50 lbs of bullets.
  4. Bowls used for bullets without exposed lead (i.e. FMJ, HPBT) should be cleaned after coating 50 lbs of bullets.
How do I clean the bowl?
  1. Fill the bowl just above the Moly stain line with corn cob or walnut media.
  2. Pour 3-4 tablespoons of bore cleaner into the media.
  3. Tumble the media/bore cleaner mixture for 30 minutes or until bowl is clean.
  4. Wipe the bowl out with a clean cloth.
  5. Degrease the bowl with liquid dish washing detergent and warm water.
  6. Some Moly will remain embedded in the plastic bowl; which is perfectly fine. This cleaning process will remove any lead deposited in the bowl.
How pure is MidwayUSA Moly?
  1. MidwayUSA Moly is 98.5% pure.
  2. Impurities are mostly residual carbon created during production.
  3. C. MidwayUSA Moly does not contain graphite. Graphite is hygroscopic and promotes rust.
What is the particle size of MidwayUSA Moly?
  1. MidwayUSA Moly is considered to be technical grade. Particle size ranges from 1 to 100 microns.
  2. The Fisher rating, or average particle size, is 3 to 4 microns.
How does Moly coating increase velocity?
  1. Moly coating actually decreases pressure and muzzle velocity because of reduced friction between the bullet and bore.
  2. Moly coating will increase terminal velocity by increasing the ballistic coefficient of the bullet. Moly has higher lubricity than the jacket material. This lubricity causes a reduced coefficient of friction in the air. The reduced drag results in a higher ballistic coefficient.
How do I obtain loading data for moly coated bullets?
  1. Load data for Moly-coated bullets is NOT interchangeable with that of non-coated bullets.
  2. MidwayUSA does not carry load data for Moly coated bullets.
  3. Moly coated bullets will reduce pressure and velocity. Loads must be worked up slowly to attain previous velocities.
  4. The maximum pressure of the cartridge must not be exceeded under any circumstances.
I’m shooting Moly-coated bullets and my groups are much larger than they were with non-coated bullets. What’s the problem?
  1. It will take approximately 15-30 "fouling" shots with Moly-coated bullets to deposit a thin coat of Moly to the bore. The first coated bullet fired will deposit a small amount of Moly in the bore close to the throat. The next bullet will deposit more Moly where the first left off. Moly deposition will continue towards the muzzle until the entire length of the bore is coated. These fouling shots will provide a sporadic group because of the varying amount of friction in the bore. After the fouling procedure rounds should "settle in" and groups will tighten up.
  2. Moly-coated bullets will reduce pressure and velocity. Loads need to be worked up slowly to attain original velocities. Dramatically reduced velocities generally deliver poor accuracy results.
  3. It is suggested that loads be chronographed when working up a new load. It will be much easier attaining desirable results with velocity data from your firearm. This is true for all load testing, not just Moly loads.
  4. Some non-Moly coated bullet/powder combinations may shoot better than a Moly-coated bullet/powder combination in a specific firearm.

©2005 MidwayUSA, Inc.
All Rights Reserved

Last edited on 15 July 2008 10:54 AM by woodsman777



____________________
FOR EVERYTHING IN LIFE -
-THERE IS A TIME AND A SEASON

WOODSMAN777

Charley
Administrator


Joined: 9 September 2005
Location: San Antonio, Texas USA
Posts: 2225
Photo: 
Are you a handloader?: Yes
Favorite type of cartridge to load?: I load everything!
Status:  Offline
 Posted: 15 July 2008 12:30 PM

Quote

Reply
Haven't heard that one before. I'm pretty sceptical about that one. If the person cannot pass one the rest of the story (supporting evidence, websites, etc), I would file it under BS.



____________________
"You all can go to Hell, I'm going to Texas" David Crockett (and probably George Bush)
The_Mountaineer
Administrator


Joined: 4 February 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 715
Photo: 
Are you a handloader?: Yes
Favorite type of cartridge to load?: rifle
Status:  Offline
 Posted: 15 July 2008 01:33 PM

Quote

Reply
I have my doubts as well.

When thinking of bullets and fouling, even cleaning barrels with uncoated cleaning rods I'm reminded of some basic physics - given two objects of different materials, one is more likely to be harder than the other. 

Moly is definitely softer than barrel metal and it will wear off but enough to build up a dangerous burr that will split barrels?  I don't think so unless it is a really poorly made barrel. 

I'm also leery of the claims that say that unless you use a coated rod you're going to damage the bore of the barrel.  I find it hard to believe that I can move a crappy 3 piece aluminum cleaning rod with as much force, velocity and pressure as a copper bullet moving 2000+ feet per second!  Sure, I still use a coated cleaning rod and "soft" bronze brushes but I don't see how the cheapo rods and brushes can cause such claimed damage.



____________________
Montani Semper Liber - Mountaineers are always free
72coupe
Handloading Master


Joined: 11 June 2006
Location: Iowa Park, Texas USA
Posts: 1493
Photo: 
Are you a handloader?: 
Favorite type of cartridge to load?: 
Status:  Offline
 Posted: 15 July 2008 01:44 PM

Quote

Reply
I call B.S. on this one. I have worn out 8 barrels with moly coated bullets without a problem. All the barrels lasted much longer than the expected life.

The 223 barrels all lasted to near 10,000 rounds and the 30 calibers lasted to 7,000. I am talking Highpower match grade accuracy.



____________________
Reloader since 1969.
miestro_jerry
HB Life Member


Joined: 28 June 2008
Location: Somerton (AKA BFE), Ohio USA
Posts: 674
Photo: [Download]
Are you a handloader?: Yes
Favorite type of cartridge to load?: I load everything!
Status:  Offline
 Posted: 16 July 2008 03:08 AM

Quote

Reply
Urban Legends abound every where.

Jerry

 



____________________
A Closed Mouth Gathers No Foot

NRA Patron Member
runfiverun
HB Full Member
 

Joined: 9 February 2008
Location: Soda Springs, Idaho USA
Posts: 70
Photo: 
Are you a handloader?: Yes
Favorite type of cartridge to load?: I load everything!
Status:  Offline
 Posted: 16 July 2008 03:32 AM

Quote

Reply
i don't even have to say it. as the show of hands already covered it.:lol:

i am not a afan of moly,  but i ain't buying that story.:confused:


 Current time is 01:05 PM




Powered by WowBB 1.7 - Copyright © 2003-2006 Aycan Gulez