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264shooter
HB Pro Staff
| Joined: | 11 June 2005 |
| Location: | California USA |
| Posts: | 75 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 20 December 2007 10:04 AM |
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| Anyone aware of an unleaded load for a .22 rimfire?Looks like the morons here in California added the .22 rimfire to the unleaded list.Next year we will not be able to hunt with a .22 in Calif unless someone comes up with a non lead bullet.They went so far as to make it illegal to have lead bullet ammo in possesion while hunting,even locked or stored in your truck.
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jjb2
addicted handloader
| Joined: | 5 July 2007 |
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| Posts: | 351 |
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Posted: 21 December 2007 03:22 AM |
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| wow! i'm not aware of any nonlead .22 rimfire ammo anywhere... sucks to be a californian more and more doesn't it??
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72coupe
Handloading Master
| Joined: | 11 June 2006 |
| Location: | Iowa Park, Texas USA |
| Posts: | 1493 |
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Posted: 21 December 2007 03:45 AM |
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| Condolences! I can't imagine what is going to become of the West coast.
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Reloader since 1969.
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Rockydog
addicted handloader
| Joined: | 26 July 2005 |
| Location: | Wisconsin USA |
| Posts: | 440 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 21 December 2007 04:05 AM |
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| 72, I imagine that the west coast will become a victim of their own intolerance. If you'd like an example of that I suspect we'd only have to follow Timber around for a day or two. America's flyover country will probably end up being the Kurds of the US. Rural, stubborn, and perceived to be ignorant and crazy by both coasts. RD
____________________
"Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not." ~ Thomas Jefferson ~
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jjb2
addicted handloader
| Joined: | 5 July 2007 |
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| Posts: | 351 |
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Posted: 21 December 2007 06:30 AM |
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| i've thought that very same thing you are mentioning about the flyover country here in iowa but i think the people on either U.S. coast is going completely nuts! but then we have some nuts right here in the midstates too.... it's kinda frightening!!!
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264shooter
HB Pro Staff
| Joined: | 11 June 2005 |
| Location: | California USA |
| Posts: | 75 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 21 December 2007 07:21 AM |
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| I work for the state of Californina so untill I retire in a couple years I'm kinda stuck here.South Dakota looking better all the time.If it wasn't for that darn cold spell called winter there.I say the Condor is an inferior species and needs to go.Or bring back the California grizzly to kill some livestock for the Condors to eat,then we can shoot whatever bullet works instaed of what bad politicized science says we should.Hope someone comes up with a leadfree .22 round soon.What I have heard from my sources the factory ammo people says its not possible to load them in a rimfire.That seems crazy to me, why not?
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72coupe
Handloading Master
| Joined: | 11 June 2006 |
| Location: | Iowa Park, Texas USA |
| Posts: | 1493 |
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Posted: 21 December 2007 02:15 PM |
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| Glenn Beck is talking more and more about people in the middle of the country and especially Texas are feeling left out of the process. He is hinting that we are not far away from a "revolution".
____________________
Reloader since 1969.
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Mark V
Administrator
| Joined: | 12 February 2007 |
| Location: | USA |
| Posts: | 243 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | No | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | big bore dangerous game |
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Posted: 21 December 2007 06:05 PM |
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Whether in California, New Jersey, Illionois and elsewhere, all of these laws have nothing to do with public safety or the environment. They simply exist to bust your balls as a hunter and gun owner to the point that you give up. That is the goal. Think how many kids will not be introduced to hunting and plinking because they have made lead 22 bullets illegal. that is just a crime. But, that is the intent of what they are doing. And the less of you there are the easier it will be to ridicule and demonize you as a knuckle dragging neandethal. Thank God for flyover country indeed.
I know a guy that moved up to New Jersey years ago. He was an avid hunter his whole life. He told me that in the last several years he has just stopped hunting period. The guns laws and hunting regulations make you just through so many hoops and are so convoluted that he simply threw in the towel and said f'k it. Again, that is exactly what the desired result of all of this is.
Last edited on 21 December 2007 06:06 PM by Mark V
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264shooter
HB Pro Staff
| Joined: | 11 June 2005 |
| Location: | California USA |
| Posts: | 75 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 21 December 2007 06:30 PM |
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| I know many hunters in this state have quit,or hunt out of state.The plan here is just as you said.Make it so people stop.Now the deal on license ansd tags is an incrimental increase every year with no cap.It cost me over $100 for a general license and 2 deer tags this year and its going up next year and the year after on and on and on.I wonder who is going to pay for wildlife programs in this state when we all stop or go elsewhwere.The Wildlife Enhancement Program for non hunters to pay was a dismal failure here.
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Mark V
Administrator
| Joined: | 12 February 2007 |
| Location: | USA |
| Posts: | 243 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | No | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | big bore dangerous game |
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Posted: 21 December 2007 08:16 PM |
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$100 for a general license? That is pretty bad.
In Texas, for $55 a resident can get a super combo that gets you:
5 whitetail tags
2 mule deer tags
3-4 turkey tags (it may be more, can't remember)
it also covers you on all small game, wild hogs, javalena, non migratory birds, predators, exotics, etc. The only thing it doesn't cover is migratory birds, alligator and pronghorn I think.
It also serves as your fishing license for both salt and freshwater.
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264shooter
HB Pro Staff
| Joined: | 11 June 2005 |
| Location: | California USA |
| Posts: | 75 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 21 December 2007 08:37 PM |
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| Just got back from South Dakota.2 deeer tags and license was $245 for Nonresidents.Small game license was $114 for birds and everything else.If I remember right Nonresident cost for Texas 2 years ago was $300 for what you describe.Won't be long till its that much for a resident in California.I'll be gone by then
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wblodgett
HB Pro Staff
| Joined: | 25 July 2007 |
| Location: | Oregon USA |
| Posts: | 63 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | small bore rifle |
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Posted: 10 February 2008 05:03 AM |
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Happened over to the CCI New Products page and saw these:
http://www.cci-ammunition.com/whats_new/whats_new_2008.aspx
22 Win Mag Speer® TNT Green™
"This lead-free bullet boasts devastating performance on game and outstanding accuracy."
I wonder if a 22 LR variant will be far behind.
-Bill
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Rockydog
addicted handloader
| Joined: | 26 July 2005 |
| Location: | Wisconsin USA |
| Posts: | 440 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 10 February 2008 03:47 PM |
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| Wonder what the price will be on the "green" stuff?
____________________
"Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not." ~ Thomas Jefferson ~
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wblodgett
HB Pro Staff
| Joined: | 25 July 2007 |
| Location: | Oregon USA |
| Posts: | 63 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | small bore rifle |
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Posted: 26 February 2008 06:57 AM |
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Not here quite yet, but they do have a expected arrival date and price listed:
http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=950079&t=11082005
CCI Ammunition 22 Winchester Magnum Rimfire 30 Grain Speer TNT Green Bullet Box of 50
Product #: 950079
Manufacturer #: 60
Our Price: $13.49
Status: Coming Soon
Date Expected In-Stock: 3/24/2008
-Bill
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Gary
HB Full Member
| Joined: | 4 April 2008 |
| Location: | |
| Posts: | 18 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I shoot factory ammo |
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Posted: 6 April 2008 02:38 AM |
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Mark V,
Same thing in Oregon, the ODFW is trying to price everyone out of hunting. Our wildlife programs are run by a bunch of clowns. They are creating more and more spotlighters and outlaws.
Luvtoshoot
Last edited on 6 April 2008 02:39 AM by Gary
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sako06
addicted handloader
| Joined: | 22 July 2007 |
| Location: | California USA |
| Posts: | 493 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 6 April 2008 05:43 PM |
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| I was at a banquet & spoke to a retired wildlife biologist about the fish & game commission lead ammo ban & the dem posing as a republican we have in ca.I was informed Ca Dept of F&G has no idea where the condors are getting the lead,the pigs are in the timber and there aren't a lot of deer being harvested in their life zone,condors can't land in the heavy cover where pig gut piles might be,they don't eat small animals they have to have a clearing as they take off running to get airborne .The g&f com took the word of the ar groups w/o investigating their findings.I read the fed info that only 1 condor died since 1997 from lead poisoning.AZ told the CA banners they're using the voluntary program and it's working. Last edited on 6 April 2008 06:21 PM by sako06
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SCSlim
HB Life Member
| Joined: | 2 May 2008 |
| Location: | Boise, Idaho USA |
| Posts: | 180 |
| Photo: | [Download] | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 28 May 2008 11:47 PM |
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So sorry, man. You guys down there in the People's Republik of Kalifornia really have a tough go. Don't know of anyone selling unleaded .22 ammo. Don't know of any legitimate science that supports a need for it. They used the Kalifornia Kondors as their patsies, but it was all based on "what if" the kondors ate some karrion that had been shot with a lead bullet. Puh-leeze. Makes me wonder what kind of karrion your legislators have been eating (I'm pretty sure of what they've been smoking).
Don't know what the solution is, other than a ballot box revolt. It could be done, but with the size of your legislature, it would be quite a project. We try to keep those gun-banning, ammo-regulating types out of our legislature up here. Been pretty effective at it, too. Part of that is because we have a part-time "citizen legislature" - which means they all have "real jobs" that they need to get back to. They convene in January and try like hell to get out of Boise by mid-March. Most of the time they succeed at that. Problem with a full-time legislature is that they have a lot of time to spend thinking up new laws to pass and new ways to restrict your freedom. The other part of is that most of us, whether D's, R's or I's, understand how the dominoes begin to fall and we're not willing to allow the first one in the chain to topple. One of those candidates for president would probably call us "bitter clingers".
Sorry for the rant. Probably should have put it in the political forum. Good luck finding lead-free .22's. Someone will make them sooner or later, which is in and of itself a double-edged sword.
Last edited on 28 May 2008 11:48 PM by SCSlim
____________________
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Ride hard, shoot straight, and always speak the truth.
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264shooter
HB Pro Staff
| Joined: | 11 June 2005 |
| Location: | California USA |
| Posts: | 75 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 29 May 2008 02:49 PM |
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| CCI has leadfree .22 mag ammo coming out sometime in the future.Was supposed to be on the market a few months ago but it's still not out.The Lady I contacted with CCI did not even have any specs or idea what it is,just that it is.As for this being a California issue I just recieved a flyer in my hunting info from South Dakota about the hazzards of eating meat tainted with lead from a bullet.Give this time and we all will using it.The military already has gone to "green bullets".
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SCSlim
HB Life Member
| Joined: | 2 May 2008 |
| Location: | Boise, Idaho USA |
| Posts: | 180 |
| Photo: | [Download] | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 29 May 2008 05:58 PM |
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Maybe ingesting small amounts of lead protects birds from the avian flu. Don't think that's ever been studied. Wouldn't it be humorous (in a macabre sense) if states go through all these pseudo-science based machinations to protect condors, geese, ducks, sparrows or whatever from lead, only to have H5N1 "bird flu" virus proliferate amongst them, then spread (typically) to pigs, then to humans?
Alarmists seem to think that being in the same square mile as pellet of bird shot is a toxic exposure or environmental catastrophe worthy of calling out a hazmat team. Prospectors find it in outcroppings on the surface, usually as galena mixed in with quartz. I've found it that way myself right here in Idaho. The point being that it's a naturally-occuring element; that lead comes from the earth - we don't make it in a test tube or atom smasher, or collect it from meteors.
Free lead is a pretty big molecule - it can't make it through unbroken skin and its dust isn't carried very well on the wind - too heavy. It's mostly the oxides of lead (the lead that China uses to paint kids' toys with) and lead salts (e.g., lead styphnate, used in primers) that are worrysome, as they can be ingested or inhaled.
So let's use copper bullets, right? Copper salts are also quite toxic, and copper is somewhat more chemically active than is lead. A little bit of that greenish stuff that forms on copper that's exposed to the environment will make you really sick. More will kill you. Most public health regulations now require that soda fountains use plastic tubing and not copper because the phosphates and carbonated water (carbonic acid) that make soda fizzy, as well as the acids in some soft drink syrups, react with copper to form toxic salts that can be carried through the lines into the soft drink cup and be ingested. I was a burger flipper when I was in high school back in the day when copper tubing was the standard for soda dispensing fountains. I actually saw the green copper salts in the bottom of a soft drink cup I had just filled with orange soda for a customer. Obviously, I didn't sell that particular cup of soda. We had a number of customers get sick from it, which convinced the parent company to change to plastic lines. That burger chain still exists today and is one of the top three you might think of.
Most of the anti-lead hysteria is based on hyperbole, promulgated to forward the political/spiritual agenda that is fanatic environmentalism, which is not all that far removed from paganism, Wicca, Gaia worship, etc. There's a difference between responsible stewardship using sound practices based on proven science and Earth worship, which is based on a faith or belief system that requires no proof. The latter, IMHO, has no more place at the public policy table than did Jerry Fallwell, if we're to evenly apply the "separation of church and state" doctrine.
All of that having been said, if there's an all-around better material to make bullets out of, then by all means ... let market forces do their thing. If it works, doesn't wreck my gun barrel, kills the elk with one shot, has a melting point low enough for me to cast my own bullets, and is more chemically inert, I'll be happy to use it. But I don't need or want the government forcing me to use an inferior substance to placate religious zealots.
The most chemically inert and environmentally friendly metal to use would be gold. With ammo prices on their way into orbit, I'm wondering if they're not already using it in factory loads.
Last edited on 29 May 2008 06:00 PM by SCSlim
____________________
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Ride hard, shoot straight, and always speak the truth.
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22fmj
HB Full Member
| Joined: | 28 November 2008 |
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| Posts: | 1 |
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Posted: 29 November 2008 09:26 AM |
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http://www.rimfireuniverse.com
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