| Posted: Wed Oct 7th, 2009 02:08 PM |
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CB on the run
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Looking for some feedback. I have a Rem 760 pump that I purchased used solely for deer hunting. The gun is in very good condition with virtually no blueing wear.
I like Barnes bullets and how they perform so I purchased some 130gr in their TSX(I believe) all copper small hollowpoint. I tried 3 powders, 3031, 335 and 4895 with poor results. I mentioned this to my gunsmith as his prior advise was certain twists will stablize certain bullet weight and lighter ones. That theory being stated, since the twist is 1:91/2 which should stablize 165-180 grs I figured that the 130 Barnes would be okay with a little lighter recoil and a good trajectory. He's now telling me that the 130gr is too short for the 30 bore. Well, I have almost a full box of the Barnes 130. Any ideas?
CB
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| Posted: Wed Oct 7th, 2009 02:38 PM |
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Slingshot
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Bump up to at least a 150 Grain bullet, 165 might work also. I have a old Rem 742 30-06 that I use 150 grain bullets in, I use the Round nose due to feeding issues. But if yours will take the SP bullets go with it.
130 grain I would use on coyotes or larger varmints. Try IMR 4064 or Alliant Reloader 15 and either IMR or Hodgons 4895.
Hope it helps.
Jeff
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| Posted: Wed Oct 7th, 2009 04:04 PM |
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Busted
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I understand what he is saying but disagree. There is no reason to not obtain good accurcy from the Barmes 130, or at least not due to it's weight. No matter how much blueing wear you might have? 
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| Posted: Wed Oct 7th, 2009 04:38 PM |
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CB on the run
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This bullet is listed as a deer/antelope round according to Barnes. Since the average deer harvested in my area is 140lbs I don't think I would have any issue with it if I can get it to shoot. My actual questions(I probably phrased my initial post wrong) does anyone agree that a 130gr isn't long enough to stabilize in a 30 bore and what powder you you recommend. Thanks.
Forget second question as I see post number 1 included powder suggestions. i did try H4895 which didn't perform.
CB
Last edited on Wed Oct 7th, 2009 04:41 PM by CB on the run
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| Posted: Wed Oct 7th, 2009 04:53 PM |
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Slingshot
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Busted wrote: I understand what he is saying but disagree.
You can't disagree with me I am a Moderator !!!!
I AM JUST KIDDING! sorry I am in a sarcastic mood 
Anyhow, I really do not have much experience with Barnes, but if you call them I am sure that they would be more then happy to answer your question. Their number is:
Barnes Bullets Inc
P.O. Box 620
Mona, Utah 84645
1-800-574-9200
1-435-856-1000
All of the Manufacturers of bullets, powder and other reloading stuff are very eager to answer technical questions. Give them a shot.
I hope this helps,
Jeff / Slingshot 
Last edited on Wed Oct 7th, 2009 04:54 PM by Slingshot
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| Posted: Wed Oct 7th, 2009 05:47 PM |
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Dragon88
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Few things. A common twist for a 308 is 1:12. That is the twist which will stabilize 165-180gr and lighter bullets. 1:9 1/2 is quite fast, I didn't really know they made 308s with that twist. That's going to limit you to the heavy loads for best performance. Also, 130gr really isn't an ideal bullet weight for the 308. 150gr, 165gr, 168gr etc are proven loads that will give good performance for what you want to do, and with those powders you have. Setting aside the gunsmith's advice and the box of bullets you already have, you best option I think is to get some bullets in the 150-168gr range and try those. Maybe you can get a little handful from a friend and try a couple groups before you buy.
My barrel is much different from yours but I tried 125gr in a 26" 1:12 and they did not stabilize well for me.
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| Posted: Wed Oct 7th, 2009 06:50 PM |
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CB on the run
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Could be a 1:12. I was reciting from memory when I searched the web last year. This gun replaced a Winchester 88 in the 308 which shot 135 Sierras very well. I don't remember the load or powder as everything I had for the gun minus the dies went with it. I hated the trigger and safety on that 88. I know the 125 wouldn't group in my brother-in-laws 30-06. I give Barnes a shout and see what they have to say after I find the twist rate. Thanks for the info.
Just checked, I was close. It's 1:10.
CB
Last edited on Wed Oct 7th, 2009 07:13 PM by CB on the run
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| Posted: Wed Oct 7th, 2009 08:04 PM |
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Timberwolf
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You have a 1:12" twist barrel not 1:9 1/2".
There is no reason that the 130gr'er's won't stabilise, mine stabilises 125gr bullets.
You should be GTG with IMR4895, but try IMR4064 and RL15.
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| Posted: Wed Oct 7th, 2009 08:35 PM |
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fryboy
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most 30 caliber twist vary between makers , usually 1-10 to 1-14 ( usually )the old lyman i have list the twist in rem 760's in 308 as 1-10, the one thing everybody must remember that every firearm barrel is a law unto it's self, chamber,throat, etc all come into play and while they may look alike on the outside and even be cut from the same reamer they are indeed different , some barrels just do not like certain bullets and sometimes when one type doesnt work well another may perform splendidly,when a spitzer bullet doesnt do well i urge folks to try a blunter profiled tip a semi spitzer or even a round nose,sometimes it also depends on how soon a bullet engages the rifling ( spitzer benefit from engaging sooner btw )the 308 was designed as a more compact 30-06 ie; 150-180 grainers and while it does come close to duplicating the 30-06 with the lighter bullets when it gets to the heavier bullets the 06 does much better ( 180-240) one of my fav bullets on 30 cal is the 125 psp,my contenders and encores have no problem with them ,my heavy barreled bolt action has no problem but the g-3...well not so good ( and not from a lack of trying )oddly enough the latter does great with 110 spire points ( go figure...)
as for powders ..wow just about any mid rate works decent in the 308,the choices are endless,it is inherently accurate ,thaz part of the beauty of it
in this gun u'll be limited by mag length but i'd try setting the bullets just off the lands if possible and trying again,barnes bullets are a critter unto themselfs,the solid copper part aggravates this
http://www.barnesbullets.com/images/308WinWeb.pdf
they only show 2 loads for ur bullet ( twist in their test barrel was 1-12) c.o.l. 2.810
if by setting it closer to ( but not into ) the rifling doesnt work u may indeed have to try a heavier bullet or a different shaped nose, g'luck and stay safe
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RobertMT
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I use IMR4320 in my Rem 742 .308, it should have same twist as 760. It shoots 110 and 130 very well with 52gr IMR4320 and CCI primer, this is a compressed load and max, it will work action on auto fine. When using 150s, I drop down to 49gr of 4320. Barnes 130 is almost as long as a 150gr traditional bullet so length shouldn't be the issue.
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Aw right all ready, I'm kneeling, I'M KNEELING! 
Thing is, the Barnes 130 Xs aren't short. Mine are 1.075", while the 150 SPCLs are 1.027", some 50 thou shorter. And it is the length that matters, not the weight.Last edited on Wed Oct 7th, 2009 11:31 PM by Busted
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CB on the run
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Timberwolf wrote: You have a 1:12" twist barrel not 1:9 1/2".
There is no reason that the 130gr'er's won't stabilise, mine stabilises 125gr bullets.
You should be GTG with IMR4895, but try IMR4064 and RL15.
Well Remington's own web site states that the twist is 1:10.
I tried 3 different powders at 50 yards all with 4" groups. So if you have a load with 4064 or R15 I'll give it another try. I know the guns better than 4" at 50 because I'm shooting 1 1/2" at 100 with factory Federal Fusions. Thanks.
CB
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| Posted: Sun Oct 11th, 2009 10:56 PM |
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Alaska
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Excellent rifle the Rem 760 in 308 Win Suggest IMR 4895 @ 43.6 with 165 Sierra BTHP Gameking and Fed 210 Match primer in FC cases.
Reloader 15 and Varget are also excellent powders for the 308 Win.
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| Posted: Tue Oct 20th, 2009 05:56 PM |
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CB on the run
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Thanks Alaska, I appreciate the info.
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| Posted: Tue Oct 20th, 2009 11:43 PM |
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miestro_jerry
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Get a hold of Tom at sample bullets, http://www.bulletsamples.com/Home_Page.html
Try the 165grain Barnes TSX bullets, I found that if you use the Barnes 168 grain TSX, you will slightly longer than the 308 spec.
Jerry
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| Posted: Wed Oct 21st, 2009 12:57 PM |
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stevekoozer
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This is what barnes reccomends with the 130's
*The 130-grain TSX has a very short shank; we recommend lightly crimping the case mouth with a factory crimp-style die to increase neck tension.
Here is the link to the page
http://www.barnesbullets.com/images/308WinWeb.pdf
I would grab a lee factory crimp die as they are not expensive and that should get you better groups. It was the anwser for me in a couple of calibers that I had diffucult time getting the barnes to group well in.
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| Posted: Fri Oct 30th, 2009 06:08 PM |
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CB on the run
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Thanks for all the info guys, I appreciate your efforts.
CB
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CB on the run wrote: This bullet is listed as a deer/antelope round according to Barnes. Since the average deer harvested in my area is 140lbs I don't think I would have any issue with it if I can get it to shoot. My actual questions(I probably phrased my initial post wrong) does anyone agree that a 130gr isn't long enough to stabilize in a 30 bore and what powder you you recommend. Thanks.
Forget second question as I see post number 1 included powder suggestions. i did try H4895 which didn't perform.
CB
My .308 Win. hunting load for Whitetail deer is a 130 gr Hornady spitzer, #3020. It's not a Barnes, but I have zero accuracy troubles, throwing them to, or under 1 moa, if I do my part with the rifle.
Lighter bullets, all things being equal, require slightly more RPM than heavier bullets for stability.
My .308 is in a BAR, Browning Automatic, 1" in 10" rifling, here is the current load (just went downstairs to check):
GI 7.62mm NATO brass, 181 gr each, +- 1 grain.
WW748BR powder, 41.5 grains
WLR primers
Cartridge OAL is 2.615", to get the bullet ogive just almost to the rifling, no canelure on the bullet.
This load length also puts the bullet base right down by the top of the shoulder, and the powder charge reaches right to the top of the shoulder, very close to a 100% density.
Also, in particular to my rifle, it does not shoot the lower loads well/accurately.
In load development, I loaded 5ea in 5 or 6 loads, at 1/2-grain increments in the "first round" of testing. The lower loadings threw 6" or even 8" groupings at just 50 yards.
As I approached the maximum loads, as the primer's started to flatten, the groups suddenly shrank. to under an inch. Then, round 2 went from 1 full grain to another, in a good-shooting range, at .2grain intervals, looking for best grouping.
Whatever shot best, was loaded for work.
The published loads are higher than mine, but, that is normally using civ. brass, with a slightly increased internal capacity, much of that I have weighs 10 grains or more less than the GI, which often weighs upwards of 187 gr each. I believe I am making those pressures with slightly lower charges, in slightly smaller spaces.
I have Civ. .308 brass that weighs 170 to 175 grains ballpark.
I tried IMR4064, it did fairly well, 748 ball simply bested it in my rifle, adn I am pleased, I love how spherical powders measure out, very good uniformity, makes my work that much easier.
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OldStuffer
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And a seccond on the Lee Factory Crimp Die, mine is great. No complaints.
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CB on the run
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The primer flattening doesn't concern you? I'm not being smart but have always been told to back off at that point. Additionally this rifle, even though in very good shape will little wear, is 40 years old. I do very much appreciate the information.
CB
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