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PhilLozano
Administrator
| Joined: | 23 May 2005 |
| Location: | Arusha, Tanzania |
| Posts: | 293 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | big bore dangerous game |
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Posted: 14 December 2006 09:30 PM |
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.416 RemMag? Or the .458 Lott
I have no problem with either cartridge on Buffalo.
The 416 is very effective, as is the Lott.
Push come to shove, I'd go with the 458 Lott, mostly because I have one and like the way it performs on all the big nasties. It has saved my butt more than a few times.
I have shot a few Buffalo and have seen many Buffalo shot with the 416, a nice Buffalo cartridge.
Now thinking of the two cartridges, I'd take the Lott.
Bigger hole and more uummppph !
____________________
Best,
Phil
Stay out of sight and downwind
Professional Hunter / Tanzania
http://www.go-on-safari.com
http://www.go-on-safari.com/talk
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475Guy
HB Full Member
| Joined: | 20 January 2007 |
| Location: | California USA |
| Posts: | 25 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 27 January 2007 05:49 PM |
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| I would love to try a 600 NE. Only one problem, my LOP is an RCH over 13.5". Everything out there except for the Rugers are way too long for me. I've tried to force myself to adapt to longer stocks to no avail. What would happen is that the butt bangs the hell out of my rotator cuff. Once that happens, you're done, KAPUT. Back when I was a kid, I tried a 577 NE that actually fit and it was a BLAST. When my old hunting partner's dad passed, the gun just sits and gathers dust. No amount of green will do.
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bea175
Board Founder
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Posted: 27 January 2007 08:39 PM |
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I have never hunted Africa, but in my opinion i just don't see how you could beat the the good old 458 Win Mag in a bolt gun under 10 lbs for really big game.
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475Guy
HB Full Member
| Joined: | 20 January 2007 |
| Location: | California USA |
| Posts: | 25 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 27 January 2007 10:56 PM |
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Granted, yes the 458 WinMag is very good with today's new powders and mono bullets in 450 gr as in the North Forks. But if you check out Taylor's Knock Out Values, bigger is better, much bigger is very much better. Don't get me wrong, I've got a few 458's in various flavors knocking around. I just LOVE the BIG stuff as I'll get more BANG for the bucks.
  
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Timberghozt
Board Founder
| Joined: | 11 February 2005 |
| Location: | Plaza De Los Armas, Mexico |
| Posts: | 5286 |
| Photo: | [Download] | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 27 January 2007 11:32 PM |
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I am actually thinking of building a 458 Win on a Mauser 98 action.I just want one to shoot a few times and see how bad it is and say I have something in the cabinet that can kill the occasional rhinoceros that runs through my wifes flowerbeds.. 
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"He who fights with monsters might take care, lest he thereby become a monster; For if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you." - F.Nietzche
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Force_Recon_Marine
Administrator
| Joined: | 7 November 2006 |
| Location: | Alabama USA |
| Posts: | 1419 |
| Photo: | [Download] | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 27 January 2007 11:44 PM |
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| You gotta watch out for those rhino's in TX. They are BAD out there. I still say .50bmg is the only way to go...
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Swift Silent Deadly
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bea175
Board Founder
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Posted: 27 January 2007 11:57 PM |
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| Hey Timber i had a 458 back in the 70's and i killed a few groundhog with it using the 500 gr Hornady . I didn't think the recoil was all that bad , but recoil never really bothered me that much as long as the scope doesn't whack you over the eye.
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Force_Recon_Marine
Administrator
| Joined: | 7 November 2006 |
| Location: | Alabama USA |
| Posts: | 1419 |
| Photo: | [Download] | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 28 January 2007 12:07 AM |
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| I have never fired a big game rifle such as the .416 or .458. I was at the gun shop today and a man came in talking about a buddy that had some big fancy something or other in .416. He said he wanted to sell it very cheap. And he was throughing in all the ammo he had with it. He killed a cape buff with it and it seperated the retina from his eye. What a deal!
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Swift Silent Deadly
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Timberghozt
Board Founder
| Joined: | 11 February 2005 |
| Location: | Plaza De Los Armas, Mexico |
| Posts: | 5286 |
| Photo: | [Download] | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 28 January 2007 12:17 AM |
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Recon,so much for that fellas experience with big bore brute force killer cartridges..
LOL bea..do ya think that 458 provided ample stopping power? JK Bro.
I really am thinkin about this.I would probably shoot reduced loads in it and only use a top end load for hunting.I would try it on a hog,big ones that is.The way the 45-70 handles em,I know that big 458 would smack the shit out of em...literally.
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"He who fights with monsters might take care, lest he thereby become a monster; For if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you." - F.Nietzche
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475Guy
HB Full Member
| Joined: | 20 January 2007 |
| Location: | California USA |
| Posts: | 25 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 30 January 2007 05:21 AM |
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| Hell, a 458 conversion is easy, just screw in a good barrel and open up the bolt face just a bit. The geometry of the inside of the box should allow you 3-4 rounds with the proper bottom metal. Besides, the 458 WinMag doesn't kick that much at all. A 338 or even a 300 would smack you harder because of the light weight. Just make sure the finished project is at least 9.5# and you'll be good to go. If you really want to push the envelope, fire off somebody's 458 Lott. It'll make you blow snot and go cross-eyed if you're not mentally prepared for it. Secret to shooting anything bigger than a 375 H&H, hang on firmly and tell yourself that you really love the ass-kicking you are about to receive.
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PhilLozano
Administrator
| Joined: | 23 May 2005 |
| Location: | Arusha, Tanzania |
| Posts: | 293 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | big bore dangerous game |
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Posted: 1 February 2007 06:39 AM |
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Force_Recon_Marine,
in .416. He said he wanted to sell it very cheap.
If you see this guy again, can you find out 'how cheap' cheap is (and WHAT it is)and let me know.
Thanks for your help.
I have a 375 H&H that I bought last year and was planning on making a 416. However, if the price and rifle are/is right, I'd just as soon grab it.
____________________
Best,
Phil
Stay out of sight and downwind
Professional Hunter / Tanzania
http://www.go-on-safari.com
http://www.go-on-safari.com/talk
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Force_Recon_Marine
Administrator
| Joined: | 7 November 2006 |
| Location: | Alabama USA |
| Posts: | 1419 |
| Photo: | [Download] | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 1 February 2007 01:13 PM |
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| I will call the guy at the gun shop this morning and see if he remembers who it was and if he knows how to contact him. If so I will shoot you a #.
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Swift Silent Deadly
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Force_Recon_Marine
Administrator
| Joined: | 7 November 2006 |
| Location: | Alabama USA |
| Posts: | 1419 |
| Photo: | [Download] | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 1 February 2007 11:22 PM |
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| Hi PhilLozano, I was in the gun shop today and he said he didnt know that guy with the eye problem but he does know someone else that has one to sell. The gun shop # is 1-866-781-GUNS toll free. Talk to Wes. He is the owner and he can point you in the right direction.
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Swift Silent Deadly
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PhilLozano
Administrator
| Joined: | 23 May 2005 |
| Location: | Arusha, Tanzania |
| Posts: | 293 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | big bore dangerous game |
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Posted: 2 February 2007 01:52 AM |
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Force_Recon_Marine,
Thanks. I will give him a call.
____________________
Best,
Phil
Stay out of sight and downwind
Professional Hunter / Tanzania
http://www.go-on-safari.com
http://www.go-on-safari.com/talk
|
475Guy
HB Full Member
| Joined: | 20 January 2007 |
| Location: | California USA |
| Posts: | 25 |
| Photo: | | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 2 February 2007 06:07 AM |
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| Phil, if you get the 416 Rem, send the 375 my way.
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Force_Recon_Marine
Administrator
| Joined: | 7 November 2006 |
| Location: | Alabama USA |
| Posts: | 1419 |
| Photo: | [Download] | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 2 February 2007 01:24 PM |
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| Glad I could help.
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72coupe
Handloading Master
| Joined: | 11 June 2006 |
| Location: | Iowa Park, Texas USA |
| Posts: | 1465 |
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Posted: 5 February 2007 02:56 AM |
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I have seen 50 cal used on Veitnamese water buffalo. Granted its not a Cape Buffalo, but still a large, tough and aggresive animal. 1st of the 1st Calvary (an armored outfit) was taking small arms fire from a small hamlet. The lined up all the tanks and armored personnel carriers hub to hub online. It didn't take long to suppress the small arms fire. In the melee, a water buffalo ran out of the village. One of the 50 gunners on an APC hammered down on him. I don't know how many times he hit the poor thing but he only managed to paralyze his back half. He was still trying to get away pulling with his front 2 legs. One of the Cav walked over and put a hand grenade under him and blew him up.
Another incident I witnessed was a charging water buffalo stopped cold by 2 rounds of 223 between the eyes.
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Reloader since 1969.
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Force_Recon_Marine
Administrator
| Joined: | 7 November 2006 |
| Location: | Alabama USA |
| Posts: | 1419 |
| Photo: | [Download] | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 5 February 2007 03:02 AM |
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| A true scene of David and Goliath. The outcome is the same though.
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Swift Silent Deadly
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72coupe
Handloading Master
| Joined: | 11 June 2006 |
| Location: | Iowa Park, Texas USA |
| Posts: | 1465 |
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Posted: 5 February 2007 03:06 AM |
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| Yeah it was a grissly scene. And not just for the water buffalo.
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Reloader since 1969.
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Force_Recon_Marine
Administrator
| Joined: | 7 November 2006 |
| Location: | Alabama USA |
| Posts: | 1419 |
| Photo: | [Download] | | Are you a handloader?: | Yes | | Favorite type of cartridge to load?: | I load everything! |
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Posted: 8 February 2007 12:37 AM |
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| Hey Phil, Did you ever talk to Wes?
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Swift Silent Deadly
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