chuckscap
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I haven't had the pleasure of hunting cape buffalo yet, but soon I hope. My rifle of choice is a CZ 550 in 500 Jeffrey, I've loaded it "down" to 500 NE levels (570g Barnes TSX at 2100 fps) after my shoulder told me to. It's very shootable and accurate (both offhand and from the bench) at these levels. Now I'm just saving my pennies. Going to take it elk hunting this fall ...
:)
Chuck
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"There's a saying in prizefighting ... Everyone's got a plan until they get hit."
Michael Douglas "Ghost In The Darkness"
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| Posted: Fri Sep 11th, 2009 01:13 AM |
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62nd Post |
miestro_jerry
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You should only load the round down when your shoulder goes numb.
Jerry
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| Posted: Fri Sep 11th, 2009 01:46 AM |
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63rd Post |
chuckscap
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How's this for a reason? Bad posture on too low a bench shooting 570g TSX's at 2450 fps ...
:)
Chuck
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"There's a saying in prizefighting ... Everyone's got a plan until they get hit."
Michael Douglas "Ghost In The Darkness"
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| Posted: Fri Sep 11th, 2009 02:16 PM |
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64th Post |
miestro_jerry
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OOOOWWWWW! That would hurt, but didn't you are go numb?
Even for a moment?
Jerry
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| Posted: Fri Sep 11th, 2009 02:31 PM |
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65th Post |
chuckscap
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I was chonographing loads and testing for accuracy. My bench was too low, so I was hunched forward, my shoulder taking all of the recoil with limited ability to rock back. After 8 shots it started to sting, I had 7 shots left, and I'm incredibly stubborn. The last 2 shots felt like someone hit my collar bone with a 32 oz ball pean hammer. I've learned my lesson. I waited a month until I shot the rifle again, but "Baby" and I have become better acquainted. I don't take her for granted anymore, and I've lightned my loads down to 500 NE Express levels. It was kind of like coming home late without calling right after you've gotten married, you don't do it twice ...
:)
Chuck
____________________
"There's a saying in prizefighting ... Everyone's got a plan until they get hit."
Michael Douglas "Ghost In The Darkness"
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| Posted: Fri Sep 11th, 2009 04:26 PM |
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66th Post |
miestro_jerry
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Chuck
I have a 600 NE Double Rifle. I know how to shoot it, one of my uncles taught me how. BUT a couple of my Macho friends wanted to shoot my "Elephant gun". I am a light weight for such a gun, they were not. One fired a single shot and gave up then the other touched off both barrels. Both of them thought I was the toughest Mudder they had ever met.
I am willing to admit, that firing such a rifle can hurt you but good, the purpose for my double rifle is for when an elephant or rhino is charging me. You don't need 1/2 MOA accuracy with this class of rifle, you just need to be able to hit a 6 foot target at 20 yards, then turn and run. Let correct that, run like hell.
That rifle doesn't get taken out very often, maybe once or twice a year. Brass isn't cheap, it uses a lot of powder and a very heavy lead slug.
Jerry
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| Posted: Fri Sep 11th, 2009 11:38 PM |
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67th Post |
chuckscap
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Jerry, I'm real comfortable with shooting my 500 Jeffrey at 500 NE levels (570g a 2100 fps). At 2100 fps, I'm happy to shoot a box of 20 rounds offhand and practice rapid fire. I think I'll be able to place my shots really well at this level. I'm taking it elk hunting in a month. In two or three years I'll make it to Africa for cape buffalo, then to Alaska for a big brown bear. If I ever feel the need for more power, there's plenty of room in the case ... I'll just need to use the lead sled from the bench and give myself time to get comfortable with it.
I have no plans to hunt elephant, but that may change once I see them in the wild ...
Appreciate the advice, actually that was day two, the bruise got bigger and more colorful as the week wore on lol ...
:)
Chuck
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"There's a saying in prizefighting ... Everyone's got a plan until they get hit."
Michael Douglas "Ghost In The Darkness"
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| Posted: Sat Sep 12th, 2009 12:18 AM |
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68th Post |
miestro_jerry
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I cast my own bullet for my 600 NE, they are 1040 grains. The load is massive.
But it's called enjoy your craft. I think these big guns are best used for coyote hunting.
Jerry
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| Posted: Mon Sep 14th, 2009 10:46 AM |
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69th Post |
leadhead
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For a stopper I want penetration and energy and nothing less than 40 cal all while being able to provide accurate and deliberate aimed fire as well as quick follow up if necessary (i.e. managable recoil). While currently lacking experience with dangerous game cartridges I want to hunt Africa very badly and doing a lot of research. A 404 jeffrey in bolt action and a 450/400 N.E. in a double seem very reasonable to me. The 458 Lott and 450 3 1/4inch also up there but something about the 404 and 450/400 just call to me. Last edited on Mon Sep 14th, 2009 10:58 AM by leadhead
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| Posted: Sat Sep 19th, 2009 02:57 AM |
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70th Post |
Don Fischer
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Never been to Africa and doubt I ever will, love to but doubt I'll make it. I'm pretty sure I would be carrying a D90 Nikon. Stopping is the job of the professional Hunter isn't it? Have no desire to kill any African animal but would love to photograph them all.
Now if I were actually hunting, I'd probably carry a 375 H&H. The hunter's job is to make a good first shot, the professional hunter's job is to administer a stopping shot. I do my job and he's home free.
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| Posted: Tue Sep 22nd, 2009 07:20 AM |
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71st Post |
rc
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With all the problems with 5.56 maybe we should revisit military use of the 45-70. That should put down a terrorist with one well placed round and not beat up the GIs too much at trapdoor levels.
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Bucks Owin
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Hi Phil. I'm just curious as to why you find disfavor with the .458 Win in it's factory form. I remember reading an article by Jim Carmichael who has apparently killed (actually "cropped" is a better word) hundreds of elephant with that cartridge. He mentioned no failings of the .458 Win. He did say that he felt an elephant was vulnerable from practically any angle using the .460 Weatherby. Perhaps he picked his shots more carefully with the .458 although he mentioned that once one elephant was shot in a herd there was generally a melee of stampeding animals and shooting became somewhat "general" as I recall. (Wish I could find the article, I may not be quoting him exactly...)
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| Posted: Sat Oct 17th, 2009 02:06 PM |
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73rd Post |
swampshooter
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PhilLozano wrote: nksmfamjp wrote:
wouldn't I just mount the scope farther forward. I got the idea for the shorter LOP from my AR.
A 458 is not an AR. The recoil is just a bit stiffer. You use a short LOP and you will have a new outline of the scope where your eyebrow used to be, I think.
And take from me . . . . . . . it really hurts.
You can only move the scope so far forward.
A thumb jammed into your nose is also painful, and a nose bleed while facing a charge would certainly increase the already present danger. While not facing a charge, this happened to me shooting a 3 1/2" 12 ga. that had the stock shortened, so even with a scout scope set-up, i wouldn't advise a short stock.
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miestro_jerry
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The problem is to have the right cartridge for the right reason. The weight of a bull elephant is lets say 11,000 pounds. How much boom does it take to knock that elephant down? Or do you want to shoot a big hole in the elephant and then run it?
I remember in Vietnam that a water buffalo got in the way and it took several shot from a M2HB to dispatch this critter. That was one tough animal.
But the question is, will the 458 Winchester Magnum do the job? Then how many people understand the stance and the body bracing you need to do with these really large bores?
Jerry
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yankeebillie
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This is coming from reading Africa I think i would choose a double probally 470 nitro express. That would make two very quick well aimed shots.
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miestro_jerry
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I want one of those 458 Garands!
Jerry
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The Cast Bullet Association
Bethesda Farmers and Sportsmen Club
ODNR Certified and Licensed Hunter
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| Posted: Mon Nov 16th, 2009 03:24 AM |
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78th Post |
PhilLozano
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Don Fischer wrote: Never been to Africa and doubt I ever will, love to but doubt I'll make it. I'm pretty sure I would be carrying a D90 Nikon. Stopping is the job of the professional Hunter isn't it? Have no desire to kill any African animal but would love to photograph them all.
Now if I were actually hunting, I'd probably carry a 375 H&H. The hunter's job is to make a good first shot, the professional hunter's job is to administer a stopping shot. I do my job and he's home free.
What if it's the P.H. that gets killed first ?
(1st. post in awhile, I just got back)
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Phil
Stay out of sight and downwind
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| Posted: Mon Nov 16th, 2009 03:29 AM |
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79th Post |
PhilLozano
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Bucks Owin wrote: Hi Phil. I'm just curious as to why you find disfavor with the .458 Win in it's factory form. I remember reading an article by Jim Carmichael who has apparently killed (actually "cropped" is a better word) hundreds of elephant with that cartridge. He mentioned no failings of the .458 Win. He did say that he felt an elephant was vulnerable from practically any angle using the .460 Weatherby. Perhaps he picked his shots more carefully with the .458 although he mentioned that once one elephant was shot in a herd there was generally a melee of stampeding animals and shooting became somewhat "general" as I recall. (Wish I could find the article, I may not be quoting him exactly...)
When I used a 458 Winnie, I found it lacking in power at 70 yards or so. Many times I did not get the chance to choose the distance at which I had to shoot.
Additionally, it is not easy to get 2100 fps out of the Winnies short case (with good bullets).
The 458 Lott fit my uses much better.
____________________
Best,
Phil
Stay out of sight and downwind
Professional Hunter / Tanzania
http://www.go-on-safari.com
http://www.go-on-safari.com/talk
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